Note as of 1/1/2018: I see that some people are still asking questions in the comments section of this article. I no longer monitor this article for questions. Feel free to connect with us on Facebook and I will be happy to answer your questions there.
(Article Updated 1/12/2017) – Updates include clarity to the AR MAGLOCK and Patriot Mag Release and minor changes not worth noting.
First, all the dopey caveats; you are responsible for knowing the assault weapons law and I am not a lawyer, nor is any of the below legal advice. I welcome corrections if you find any of the below to be inaccurate. This is all new so uncertainty is everywhere. The below is based on my reading of the law. The DOJ may interpret and enforce it differently than it is written. I will update in future articles as we learn more from the DOJ.
What happened?
Governor Brown signed 5 gun control laws on Friday morning, July 1st (Independence Weekend, oh the irony). This article will address only one of those 5 bills; the re-defining of assault weapons and registration requirement (SB 880/ AB 1135). I will discuss what the other 4 bills mean in a separate post later this week. It just get’s too long to discuss all of them in a single article. Since Friday morning, our little gun shop has received hundreds and hundreds of phone calls and customers asking the same question, “What the F*** just happened and what does it mean for me?”. This article is meant to answer that question.
What do SB 880 and AB 1135 do?
California has been trying to eliminate and/or criminalize possession of AR and AK style rifles for 17 years. Since the Assault Weapons Control Act of 1989 California has defined an “assault weapon” as any semiautomatic centerfire rifle with a removable magazine PLUS any of the following evil features (oversimplified for relevance and brevity):
- Pistol grip
- Forward pistol grip
- Adjustable stock
- Flash suppressor
For the remainder of this article I will refer to the above list as “evil features”. The key word here is “Removable Magazine.” Since 2007, California AR and AK owners have been able to use a bullet button to avoid the classification of “assault weapon.” Since the bullet button required a tool to drop the mag, it did not qualify as a “removable magazine.” Instead it was considered to be a “fixed magazine.” Since the rifle had a “fixed magazine” it was not an assault weapon. SB 880/ AB 1135 redefine a “fixed magazine” to be something that “cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.” Since bullet buttons don’t require the disassembly of the firearm action, even a rifle with a bullet button installed is now an “assault weapon.” Rifles with a bullet button are now considered to have a “removable magazine,” not a “fixed magazine.” Basically, we’ve all been using the bullet button “loophole” in the law to keep our rifles legal and the government just closed that loophole.
You may not purchase a rifle after January 1, 2017 that has any of the above evil features AND a “removable magazine.” Nor can you build a stripped lower that was purchased after January 1, 2017 to include evil features and a removable mag. After January 1, 2017 you cannot buy a rifle with evil features from either a dealer or a private party unless it uses an “AR MAGLOCK” or “Patriot Mag Release” (more on this device later). You must also register any “assault weapon” you own with the California DOJ BEFORE January 1, 2018. You are guilty of a felony if you do not register your weapon with CAL DOJ before this time or remove the evil features or install an AR MAGLOCK/ Patriot Mag Release device. Registration of an assault weapon will be done via a website and require a fee of $20. The fee is, of course, subject to change. You can only register weapons you owned prior to January 1, 2017 as taking possession of or building an “assault weapon” after this time is illegal.
What does owning an “assault weapon” mean?
If you register your gun as an assault weapon, there are draconian limitations on how you own and transport the gun. You can never sell, give, lend, or trade an assault weapon to another person. Nor can you hand down an “assault weapon” to your spouse, children, or grandchildren. If you move out of the state, you cannot move back into the state with your guns. If your gun needs to go to a gunsmith, you must remain with your gun while it is being worked on.
What happens to my guns when I die?
When you die, your “assault weapon” essentially dies with you. When you die, your guns will generally be handed down by bequest or by succession, usually to your spouse or children. With the implementation of these laws, your spouse or child (or whoever) has no more than 90 days to send the guns out of state, render them permanently inoperable, or to turn them over to law enforcement for destruction. If your spouse or child has possession of the guns 90 days after your death, they have committed a felony punishable by 16 to 36 months in county jail and substantial fines.
Can I lend my gun to my friend so he can go hunting for the day?
No. You can never lend your registered “assault weapon” to someone else for any reason. If you loan your rifle to a friend, neighbor, co-worker, etc. for any reason, you have both committed a felony punishable by 16 to 36 months in county jail. The gun is not allowed to be out of your possession. You can only let a friend use your gun if you are in immediate proximity to the gun at all times. That means, if you stay in one tree stand and your friend walks 50 yards up the road to the next hide and posts up with your gun, you have both committed a felony.
When does this go into affect?
You may not purchase an AR with any of the evil features or a stripped lower that will contain evil features after January 1, 2017. You must register any gun with evil features and a removable mag with the Cal DOJ and pay the fee before January 1, 2018.
Can I avoid registering my gun as an “assault weapon”?
Under this law you have 3 options if you want to avoid a felony; register the gun as an assault weapon, OR remove the evil features from the gun, OR install a device that requires you to break the action of your AR open (i.e. disassemble the receiver) to remove the magazine. You do NOT need to register the gun as an “assault weapon” if you commit to one of the other 2 options.
The AR Maglock and Patriot Mag Release require you to “disassemble the action” to drop the mag.
As an alternative to registering, you can install a device that requires you to disassemble the action in order to remove the mag. There are two options for this called the AR MAGLOCK and the Patriot Mag Release. (The Patriot Mag Release was originally called the Bullet Button Reloaded). A video of how these devices work can be found here (ARM) and here (PMR). These devices require you to break the gun open (i.e. disassemble the receiver) to drop the mag. By definition, this means you no longer have a “removable magazine” on your AR. Remember, an assault weapon is defined as a gun with BOTH evil features and a removable magazine. If there is no removable magazine then there is no “assault weapon”. There is a similar device for AKs called the AK MagLatch. There is a video of this device in action here.
Alternatively, you can remove all evil features from your gun. You’ll have to use a “shark fin” grip instead of a pistol grip. This is a piece of plastic that prevents your thumb from wrapping around the grip. If you have a flash hider, you will need to replace it with a compensator. If you have a compensator that has a flash hider on the end (like the VG6 Epsilon), you’ll need to replace it with one that doesn’t (like the VG6 Gamma). Your adjustable carbine stock must be replaced with a non-adjustable rifle stock or be permanently pinned in place. You cannot have a forward pistol grip. If you remove all of the evil features from your gun, then you can have a standard mag release. No more bullet buttons if you go this route.
This rifle is featureless and does not meet the definition of an “assault weapon”
What does “Featureless” mean?
Featureless means no evil features. See the paragraph above. If you have a featureless rifle then you do not need to register it as an “assault weapon.” However, after January 1, 2018 a featureless rifle can never again be turned back into a rife that contains any of the evil features. Once featureless, the rifle is forever featureless.
What About AR Pistols?
AR pistols have the same requirements as AR rifles, but with a kicker just to make you even angrier. While handguards (sometimes called “rails”) are fine on a rifle, they are considered to be an evil feature on a pistol. Therefore, it isn’t possible to make an AR/ AK pistol featureless. Your AR pistol is an “assault weapon” as of January 1, 2017 and must be registered with the Cal DOJ before January 1, 2018. Alternatively, you can use the AR MAGLOCK or Patriot Mag Release as described to avoid registering.
What About AK Pistols?
As with AR pistols, AK pistols cannot be made featureless. AK pistols will need to be registered before January 1, 2018 or must use a device similar to the AR MAGLOCK called the AK MagLatch.
What about 80% Lowers?
Same as above. Your AR rifle or AR pistol built on an 80% is an “assault weapon” if it contains any of the evil features described above. If you wish to keep those evil features on your gun, then you are required to serialize it and register it with the Cal DOJ before January 1, 2018. Of course, you can still use the AR MAGLOCK/ Patriot Mag Release or make the gun featureless to avoid registration.
Does this mean I can remove my bullet button and use a standard “free state” mag release?
Unfortunately, no. The DOJ made up new law out of thin air (that’s how things get done in California) and declared that a person registering their assault weapon must keep the bullet button on the gun. There is absolutely nothing in the law that says this. The regulatory authority (the DOJ) just made it up.
What about my bolt action gun?
This applies to semi-auto guns only. Bolt action rifles are not affected.
What about my 22lr caliber rifles?
The law specifies “centerfire” rifles. 22lr caliber rifles and other rimfire guns are not affected. However, a 22LR pistol can be considered an assault weapon if it also contains evil features. Only rifles have the “centerfire carve out.”
What about my Glock/ 1911, etc. pistol?
SB 880/ AB 1135 define an “assault pistol” (I swear I didn’t make up that term) as having “A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.“ That basically means an AR-style handguard. Handgun slides like you find on a Glock are exempted. Bottom line, this doesn’t affect your semi-auto 1911/ Glock-style handguns.
Can I still purchase stripped lowers after January 1, 2017?
Yes. You can still purchase stripped lowers after January 1, 2017, however, they cannot be built into “assault weapons”. All lowers purchased after January 1, 2017 MUST be built as featureless rifles or built with the AR MAGLOCK or Patriot Mag Release.
Can I sell my rifle after January 1, 2017?
If you registered your gun as an “assault weapon”, then you cannot ever sell, trade, lend, transfer, donate, or pass it down. That rifle is attached to you forever and dies with you. Repeat: You cannot sell an “assault weapon”. However, you can sell a featureless rifle. You can also sell a rifle with the AR MAGLOCK/ Patriot Mag Release. See next item below.
Can I turn my “assault weapon” into a featureless gun to sell it?
Yes. You can turn your registered “assault weapon” into a featureless gun and sell, trade, transfer, or pass it down. However, you must “DE-REGISTER” the gun with the DOJ. There is a process for De-registering the gun. Once the gun is De-registered and made featureless, then it cannot ever be turned back into an “assault weapon.” It must remain featureless (or use the AR MAGLOCK) forever even by the new owner.
What if I live out of state and am moving to California. Can I bring my rifle with me?
No. California strictly forbids the import of “assault weapons.” If you bring your gun into California after January 1, 2017 then you are a felon the moment you cross the state line. After January 1, 2017 all rifles must be made featureless or install the AR MAGLOCK/ Patriot Mag Release before they come into the state.
The only exception to this is for military personnel being transferred to the state of California on orders. If you are ordered to California, then you may bring your “assault weapons” with you, but you must register them with the Cal DOJ and then all of the other rules regarding sale, transfer, lending, inheriting, etc. apply. Military personnel on orders are the only people who can register an assault weapon after January 1, 2018. Anyone else coming into the state must make their rifle featureless, instal the AR MAGLOCK or leave the rifle behind when they move.
I hope the above helps. As always I remain available to answer questions. Questions/ Comments can be posted below or on Facebook. (Updated 1/12/17: I will do my best to revisit this article from time to time and answer questions posted below. However, it is beginning to become unmanageable. Questions posted on FB are usually answered within a few hours.)
Ryan,
Don’t all AR Pistols have “C”? Am I reading that ALL AR Pistols must be registered as AW’s? Or is there an option for a featureless AR Pistol?
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
AR pistols can NOT be made featureless. The law defines an “assault weapon” as anything with BOTH the evil features you listed AND a removable magazine. You could use something like the Bullet Button Reloaded or make it featureless. As of the time of this writing, I am still efforting to understand if the Bullet Button reloaded qualifies as “disassembly of the action.” I’ll have more on this soon.
I don’t think that this article fully covers the bases for a few reasons.
First, I must state that no-one should register their weapons under these laws. No-one should comply. That is the best way to defeat these laws.
One very big reason is the existence of FOPA. federal law, FOPA, prohibits the “United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof,” from establishing “any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or disposition.” Under FOPA, California is prohibited by federal law from developing any kind of registry of non-NFA firearms. (The California government will still try to continue to develop registration schemes with the ultimate objective of bans and seizure of property, but you’re not obligated to participate in any registration scheme. One could argue that we do have an obligation to take the issue to the courts rather than do nothing about it, but it’s simply not true that there is an obligation to comply with the registration requirement.)
The other bit to mention is having to do with the specific language of the bills.
AB 1135 – “requiring,” (that is, _attempting_ to require, in violation of FOPA and the US Constitution), in part, that any person who, from January 1, 2001, to December 31, 2016, inclusive, lawfully possessed an assault weapon that does not have a fixed magazine, as defined, and including those weapons with an ammunition feeding device that can be removed readily from the firearm with the use of a tool, register the firearm with the Department of Justice before January 1, 2018, but not before the effective date of specified regulations.
Apart from the FOPA (prohibition on registration requirement) previously mentioned, another issue with AB 1135 is that it is a retroactive law and that the states are prohibited from passing ex post facto laws by clause 1 of Article I, Section 10 of the US Constitution. So even before taking the 2nd Amendment into account, this law is facially unconstitutional.
Technical circumvention seems to have focused on the word “readily.” For this reason, the Bullet Button Reloaded and the Armaglock so far have been front and center as the items which most likely will be the market solution.
Then there’s SB 880. This bill defines an “assault weapon” in part as: “A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon. (…)”
This bill also attempts to “require” (again, in violation of FOPA and in violation of the US Constitution) “that any person who, from January 1, 2001, to December 31, 2016, inclusive, lawfully possessed an assault weapon that does not have a fixed magazine, as defined, and including those weapons with an ammunition feeding device that can be removed readily from the firearm with the use of a tool, register the firearm with the Department of Justice before January 1, 2018”
Another unconstitutional retro law.
In order to technologically circumvent this problem (for the AR) you’d also need to eliminate that pistol grip. This is where something like the Monsterman grip becomes useful.
This assumes you want to make a basic effort to eliminate concerns that law enforcement might try to charge you with a crime for utilizing the rifle somewhere (even though the laws themselves are patently unconstitutional and violate FOPA).
Under SB 880, “assault weapon” (also) means any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
(b) For purposes of this section, “fixed magazine” means an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm in such a manner that the device cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.
So as of right now today, I can make my own pistol (1911 for example) in my home, from 80 percent frame, so long as I don’t add onto it a threaded barrel (e.g. no ability to add silencer, etc). There’s no requirement to serialize or register it. In like manner, I can (using a drill press, for example) make my own receiver (AR) from an 80 percenter, and so long as I don’t add evil features to the build (e.g., keep it simple, add a bullet button reloaded or armaglock, and a monsterman grip), I shouldn’t have to worry about law enforcement.
At the same time, I think we have an obligation to challenge these laws in court. They are unconstitutional and also they violate FOPA.
Cheers!
You got valid points have you thought about fighting this in court? You should.
Agree. I have no intention of registering my AR15. I will not dispose of my 30 round .223 magazines. I will not dispose of my suppressors. I will continue to carry a concealed weapon whenever I choose to. DILLIGAF.
u will go to jail and be humbled to the state
me too they can kiss my butt
When you get caught with that clip and get charged with a felony and then have all your guns permanently taken away…
You will think to yourself… well that was a stupid idea.
What’s a clip?????
Tim, it’s only a misdemeanor to conceal without a permit. Your firearm will be confiscated, and you have to apply to get it back, which you would. So, there’s that…
Ignore that Libtard(Phil Long).
i am with you! i will not register any of my ar’s. just try and take my weapons!!!!!!!!
I am one of the approximately 7 million gun owners in Calif. Seven million is more than TWICE the population of the state of Arkansas where I was born a long time ago. Just for comparison purposes the black population in Calif. is LESS THAN 3 million. What’s my point? If the 7 million gun owners in Calif. organized into “A well regulated militia …” would we then have a better chance of defying these onerous laws? Also, would we stand a better chance of winning Second Amendment issues brought to the SCOTUS? If so, and if every gun owner in Kalifornicka sent in $2 (only 8 quarters or pocket change!) we’d have a $14 million dollar war chest for organizational costs and legal battles. What if the Calif. Republican Party organized as a militia? Just askin’ and thinkin’ …
Great when we start
I’m with you on this.
I have 8 quarters in my pocket now. What are we going to call this militia?
maybe we could get the NRA to sponsor this
Were were they’d 7 million gun owners when it came to voting these stupid laws down?
You do realized that there are nearly 40 million people in california right? 7 of 40 is what? 18 percent of the population?
Bro,
It is so disappointing how the “gun lobbyists”, do not come to fight for California. As for the NRA, well fuck them big time. I have known about them, being a bitch for the government, for a long time. That is why I am not a member. The Republican Party is just another bullshit party, as we’ve seen with this past election, they don’t care about people’s wants. They are, a hoe for the elite.
I read this article, and I was just furious. But then again, I have been furious with Cali, for a long time. I read through most of the comments in this article and enjoyed them a lot, more then the article itself. As one of the comments said, the normal hard working people don’t have time to organize, to deal with this shit. We are all working hard and long hours, with barely any time for our own families, not to mention issues.
I would love to contribute with money to a true people’s gun organization lobby, but I’ve yet to find one. And I’ve searched and I’ve searched and I’ve searched. You’d be surprised if you not only knew, how many of them are there just to make some money, but, you’d be more surprised, if you knew how many of them are set up by our ruling elite (government). To keep an eye on and to keep records on liberty lovers, like you and me.
I have no choice, but to call in quits with this fucked up state. I am from Russia and I’ve seen this shit before. I can recognize tyranny crawling in. Luckily, here in the U.S.there are places to escape. In Russia, we had nowhere to hide, that’s why, we were willing to risk our lives and escape to America. But, where do we go from here.
I’m not saying. I’m just saying.
For Liberty
Aloha
100%
Instead of 8 quarters out of our pocket, everyone should join SAF and send an extra $2 bill to the Second Amendment Foundation with a letter that it’s for fighting the unconstitutional Crapifornia laws. They fight in the courts and win.
Ohh my gosh! I’m just learning of this featureless non sense. I live in Missouri where gun laws are very lacks. Please California gun owners. FIGHT THIS! I will be seeing what I can do to spread the word and find out how I can help. This is horrible. No other constitutional right would be molested like this. Imagine if your right to an attorney was slaughtered like this, let’s say the court would only let a lawyer represent you that didn’t look scary or was a registered democrat? This has to be stopped.
I have a feeling we are headed for a civil war! I will not register a damn thing
That’s a great idea… we need to get to work on that
Let see:
Ban military assault style weapons.
Make everyone register what assault style weapons that they have.
Make them felons for failing to register.
Feel good about thinking your doing something.
Release prisoners – crime up.
Release more prisoners – More crime
California voters need to wake up to what is happening.
Nice thoughts
I’m surprised nobody voted these communists out.
Well, it was a drive started by Barry Bahrami to repeal ALL this new laws signed by Moonlight Brown on July 1st 2016.
I spent 6 weeks in scorching heat collecting signatures near one of the Turner’s. And there were many guys/gals like me all around the state.
We were practically at every range, gun store, even some fast food joints where owners were pro 2A and volunteered to collect signatures.
We had few doctors collecting in their offices.
We had to have 550,000 signatures by Sept 21, 2016 to start repeal process.
Guess what?! We managed to gather only about 100,000 – give or take a bit.
So, WHERE THE HELL WERE 7 MILLIONS KOMMIFORNIA GUN OWNERS?!!!
COUNT ME IN!!!!! HELL I’LL SEND IN $100.00 A MONTH JUST LIKE MY NRA DUES.
FOPA only apllies to federal law enforcement. No where in FOPA does it mention state or local restrictions.
federal law has always superseded state and or local law regardless if that state sign the US constitution or not. I’m not a 100 percent but i believe it was ether pete wilson or jerry brown in his first governor’s term. but the government of california never signed the us constitution. I’m not sure what president said this but he said. he said if you want to handle things this way the us government will no longer support california in an any way for whatever reason financial or other wise. State of California has been riding a thin line with the US money men ever since.
FOPA just says that registries can’t be made from federally mandated documents. It’s illegal to use 4473s to make a registry. CAs law isn’t illegal in this regard.
And whatever you’re saying about the recently passed bill makes very little sense
The state of California wasn’t a state when the constitution was ratified by the original thirteen states. Dope. California was still owned by Mexico then
All this does is make the people that don’t care about life liberty or the American right to bare arms ez for them to make us all victims of gun vilance. When our rights are taken away we are nothing but sheep and targets for the criminals. I like the quote. .”I would rather have a good weapon and not need to use it than to need it to protect my family,myself and helpless bystanders and not be able to protect my constitutional rights to bare arms. I have a CCW and will definitely defend myself and my loved ones with deadly force if the situation calls for it. I WILL NOT BE A HELPLESS VICTIM AND NOT GO OUT WITHOUT A FIGHT!!!
As far as the 80% lowers go. California has that covered now too. Under the new law you have to now serialize and register 80% lower receivers, weather you owned them before Jan 1,2017 or not.
You are incorrect in your information. 1st a 80% is not a firearm. That’s why its called an 80% . I could call my truck an 80% AR but until it is able to discharge a round it is not a firearm. 2ndly if a completed 80% (100%) does not have “the evil tems” defined above then it does not need to be serialized and registered.
Amen brother
Totally agree and will stand up for that fight…. 🙂
I agree completely with Freethink for a couple of important reasons.
First of all to “not comply with these laws” and register any so called ‘assault weapon’ IS a way to beat this law. How many hundreds of thousands of Californians would become felons by not following the law? We already have overcrowding in prisons by so called unviolent criminals and this would force the judicial system to more than likely not imprison anyone who has violated these new laws. Of course nobody wants to be considered a felon which in itself would preclude you from owning any type of handgun or firearm, but these new laws will further impact our already overloaded court system and take away important resources from law enforcement to concentrate on solving and/or preventing violent crimes. Don’t give the judicial system the ability to reap the harvest of “low hanging fruit” by providing a means to easily target yourselves as criminals when the majority of the owners of these so called ‘assault rifles’ are good, honest, law abiding citizens. The liberal attorneys will use this as a demonstration of how they are cleaning up society regardless of what it does to gun related crimes, i.e. shootings, gang warfare and robberies.
On top of what Freethink has very well stated, you must also consider the fact that these laws are in direct conflict with our current rights as citizens which brings me to my second and more important reason for not following these new laws. The fourteenth amendment to the original bill of rights passed by congress in 1866 and ratified in 1868, contains several reasons why the new laws are not only absurd but in direct conflict with our current rights as citizens.
Two of the four elements of section 1 of the 14th amendment mandate that
no state can strip any of its residents of the full privileges of American citizenship.
Element 3 mandates “all citizens are guaranteed ‘due process of law,’ which means that states cannot pass arbitrary or unfair laws”.
Element 4 mandates all citizens are guaranteed “equal protection of the laws,” which means that states cannot discriminate against particular groups of citizens. These broad guarantees of citizens’ rights form (together with the Bill of Rights) the heart of American civil liberties and civil rights law. In short, the state of California is discriminating against law abiding citizens who are in a group of people that own a certain type of firearm.
One could also argue against some of the terminology used in the two bills including but not limited to a “forward pistol grip”. The dictionary definition of a pistol grip is as follows: “A handle or grip as a rifle or saw, shaped like the butt of a pistol” therefore does not descriptively relate to the forward or vertical grip on a rifle or, and use the term loosely, an ‘assault weapon’. A pistol grip is what was originally provided on the Thompson sub machine gun, also known as the “Tommy Gun”.
I digress but could go on and on. The bottom line is as “Freethink” so clearly explained, the best way to move forward is not comply with these new laws by registering your weapons.
The gun laws in California not only tramples Second Amendment rights but it will mark the end for f business for many small gun shops. Tragic. Let California show you what can be done to limit our rights.
I compltely agree. It is our civic duty to take appropriate action to fight off any and all tyrrany.
These bills were signed into law by Gov. Brown in response to two Muslim terrorists illegally obtaining AR-15’s and killing co-workers in San Bernardino. But rather than sign laws to prevent Islamic terrorism, let’s punish law abiding California tax payers and make it harder for us to defend ourselves…F*ck you very much Governor!
I agree to that 100 %
Also by requiring a background check to buy ammo they will look to see if you have a registered gun for that ammo. If not then they will not sell you the ammo. Damn commie bastards.
Gov brown is and has always been a tool. Why we are having this conversation in the first place is because the general population are mindless aholes. They should have never voted for this fool, after what was done the first time he was governer. You can’t fix stupid.
Quick question the article states that any firearm made with an 80% lower has to be registered by Jan 1 2018 I know u previously said we don’t HAVE to comply but for those who do want to would that mean that one can’t purchase an 80% lower after that date, build a firearm, & then go register it?
You can still buy a 80% lower but can’t build with evil features.
Well, there is no known date of manufacture on an 80% lower. At least not that is traceable by the government. The date of manufacture is what you say it is. You can still buy 80% lowers after January 1, 2017. You can still complete 80% lowers after January 1, 2017. However, you are only supposed to register them if you had completed it before that date.
Very good points and very great points on the retro /expo laws are indeed unconstitutional on its face. The problems are two fold. One we have a liberal legislative branch in our government who make these laws up and vote exemption to their own laws. Secondly , our state supreme court too is factually liberal and do dictate what is a punitive and what is administrative. This law is know differently expressed than the sex registry laws we have in California . Both laws are unconstitutional for mandating Californians to forcibly require them to be on a registry or face stiff prison time. Both registries are similarly situated constitutionally because although one is a ballot measure/initiative and the other is criminal, borderline double jeopardy, they both have the same issues at hand and that is retroactive requirement and that is explicitly a violation of the U.S. constitution of the United states of America.
I completely agree. Do not register anything! Any law that is unconstitutional is not law, and it is our duty to nullify it. Furthermore should you ever find yourself on a jury, regarding any of these unconstitutional laws it is your duty to find the person not guilty. Therefore nullification!
I completely agree. Do not register anything! Any law that is unconstitutional is not law, and it is our duty to nullify it. Furthermore should you ever find yourself on a jury, regarding any of these unconstitutional laws it is your duty to find the person not guilty. Therefore nullification!
Are you an attorney that deals with proposed and enforced laws such as these?
or you do like i plan to, register your assault weapons to your adult kids. my son will be of age by the time deadline rins out, and i will register them to him, that way if he chooses to remain in the state he will be completely legal in owning them, and no need to have them “passed down” to him. i am 100% pro second amendment, and im also a retired 20yr gun dealer/gunsmith. at this point in my life, i dont think i want to have to worry about a felony on my record. wouldnt be easier to vote for a frickin republican govenor in november that to contemplate constantly how to get around these idiotic laws? the people of this state continually vote in retarded idiots such as governor moonbeam who sign this sort of legislation, and then cry when laws are signed that they KNEW would be introduced before voting (yes knew, as california has a track record of tis kind of bullsh*t)
Excellent.
That is a very good idea..
No he won’t. I left Connecticut after they passed the same type of laws. While I was still living there myself and others we required to register, only 14% did. No one to this date has ever been arrested as they do not know where the guns are. Its also just a huge scare tactic. They even tried a second round of registration with no punishment, no one showed up.
“the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed”
and now its up to the people to keep that right regardless of the weak politicians, who now think their kings, think.
When did they try to get people to register in Connecticut?
It’s really messed up when previously legal possession suddenly becomes a felony. I can understand if someone has a previously legal 30 round magazine in CA and forgets, and gets slapped with a misdemeanor.
The problem here folks is that these new laws carry a felony charge. You not complying with the latest scare from Sacramento equals being just as bad as someone who rapes, murders, or destroys society. This is not acceptable.
Additionally, just one AR violations is a felony and you will lose all your guns.
If there is somewhere to focus it should be in incriminating previously law abiding citizen whom the state deemed safe into felons within 13 months, if they do t raise their hand, do a dance, and let the CA know where their stash of guns are at and that they are ok with CA destroying your private and preoously legal property after you die without compensation.
Mike D –
There was an arrest in CT on April 16, 2014 for failure to register an “Assault Weapon.”
Search ‘James Toigo Connecticut’ for the story. I lived in CT from May ’93 until Dec 5, 2012 and reading that Mr. Toigo was charged with Animal Cruelty for shooting a squirrel just reminded me of how stupid some of the LEO’s are. Corruption is a state sponsored sport and they’re supreme champions. I’m so glad that I don’t live there anymore.
any time you want to go shoot it you will have to bring your son with you since you cant borrow it
Family can….
Dear Bushman,
I also am considering registering my AWs in my adult child’s name! However Wouldn’t I be committing a felony if I want to go shoot my guns? At least outside of my child’s immediate proximity?
im asuming so, but what can you do. only other options are to either make them featureless, hide them or convert them to 22 with either a dedicated 22lr upper or something like a drop in 22lr conversion.at least that way you could legally possess and shoot them, put as many evil features on them as you like and if SHTF, you could change them back to 556 in about 20 seconds just by changing the bolt. this is something i may actually do. granted once you drop that 556 bolt back in, its an instant felony, but if it were a SHTF situation ,that would be the least of your worries. at least if you wanted to shoot 556 and lived close to a free state ( such as i do, i live within an hour and a half from both nevada and oregon) you could pop across the border, drop in your 556 bolt, shoot, and change it ba.ck. that would be legalmy 7 1/2″ pistol will have to be registered, but i could live with that as i think something like that would be no fun to shoot at all in a break action reload gun.
I have been told to put them in a trust, as long as you are alive, you can shoot them. When you die, the trustee then becomes the legal owner of the firearms. I’m sure there is more to it than that but, that is the just of what I have been told to do.
Watch the video linked here.
You can joint register to every family member over the age 18
https://www.facebook.com/SC2AS/posts/936688289797912
hey, bushman (or anyone else who knows)…
you talk about registering your AWs to your “of age” son. my question is: what is “of age?” better yet, where in the law can i find the age restrictions?
i went to my local dealer today to buy my 19-year-old son an AR-15 with the intent of registering it to him in 2017. i know that current california law says you must be 18 years old to purchase & register a long gun, but the dealer told me that (one of) the new law(s) changes this minimum age requirement to 21 years old for AWs.
i can’t find anything anywhere on minimum ages for registration. help, please?
Hey i was looking at the comments, you said something about dropping a 22lr conversion kit to avoid registration. Now lets say i go out next year and buy a stripped lower and put all of the “evil” features and put a 22lr bolt will that be alowed?
Centerfire: bad/evil
Rimfire: not evil.
.17 rimfire, not illegal but has something to it.
I wish more people would vote these libtards out of office
I think this is beyond lib or conserve, this is gov vs. the people of the USA period. There are some anti gun laws coming from the current prez admin, mark my words well.
I’m not following on the arpistol thing all the way. If I register the pistol as an assault weapon, I still have to pin and weld a compensator? That doesn’t make sense to me, as it seems that once it’s an assault weapon, it kind of unlocks being able to have it however you want.
Hey Mike. I was wrong on making a pistol featureless. I missed something in my initial reading of the law. I have modified the article above to reflect this. On pistols (not on rifles), the handguard is considered an evil feature, so it is nearly impossible to make a pistol featureless. Pistols will pretty much have to be registered or use the new bullet button.
Isn’t an AR pistol always going to be an “assault weapon” and therefore subject to registration by operation of PC 30515(a) (3): “A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches” ? I think the AR “pistol” and “rifle” distinction is dubious, since neither of those terms are defined.
Who makes the shark fin…looks kinda cool
You can get shark fins and other featureless stock and grip solutions in our shop and in many shops here in Cali.
Will I have to register my AR 15 styled firearm if I put on a Bullet Button reloaded or AR mag lock
No. The article has been updated to reflect this.
Have you heard anything on the bullet button reloaded or the AR mag lock that will make AR 15 California compliant and will I have to remove the collapsible buttstock in the flash Hider
If you use the AR Maglock then you can keep all of your evil features.
That is also how I read the legislation. In section “N” is states plain as day that dissasemly of the action is separating the upper from the lower by using the the pivot pin as the fulcrum. At this point the action is open and you can release the mag. This is their definition as a “fixed mag”, so if you have these new bullot buttons then indeed you can keep the “evil features”. Slam dunk to me. People have said you won’t be able to clear a double feed or other similar malfunctions, however if you also pull out the front pivot pin along with the take down pin you can very carefully slide the upper forward and off, and even slide it partially forward and open enough to utilize the AR Maglock in the gap between the receivers. I have done an abundant amount of research on this, hope this helps. I will also be writing an article soon on my company website at practicaltacticalsurvival.com. Thank you to the the author of this article as it greatly assists in the understanding of the new regulations!
If I read the bill text correctly, we are also required to register certain 22 lr handguns like ATI GSG series (H&K clones)
The center fire rule seems to apply only for rifles.
That is correct about the centerfire portion only applying to rifles, however I’m not familiar with the ATI GSG specifically.
Gunfighter
why , if the state has already deemed both free state mag releases AND bullet buttons as assault weapons would you be commiting a felony for going ahead and changing your bullet button to a FSMR? rifles and pistols with EITHER type as of now are deemed assault weapons so technically until their registered , BOTH types are considered the SAME in the laws eyes!!! if you register your rifle after the first of the year, their not going to ask you if it was a BB or a FSMR gun!
Honestly bushman, you’d have to consult an attorney for clarification on this. It is my advice that you don’t swap the bullet button to a free state mag release until AFTER you register. It is true that I can point to NOTHING in the law that states this. You are correct, both are considered assault weapons. Personally, I wouldn’t do it, but I can’t point to anything to tell you why.
You say “disassemble of the action” to remove the magazine. What if you just lock out the magazine release for good? So you’d have to flip the upper down and load the magazine while still in the receiver? Would a locked out magazine release button exempt your AR from the ban? A lock that took a special tool to remove?
Yes, but there are easier ways to accomplish this, such as the AR Maglock.
Indeed. Also like a lot of other writers mention, you should always consult with an attorny for legal adavice, including the info I just posted a few minutes ago on here. What we have always done is keep a copy of the legislation in the gun case, just in case you get harassed you have offical writing from the DOJ with you.
So a maglock on an AR Pistol will allow you not to register it ?
Yes. That is correct.
Back in the day an acquaintance legally bought a preban AR, but was not aware of the limited time for Registering it as an Assault Rifle. Since then the rifle was dismantled and the lower basically locked away in the gun safe dungeon. Under the new Assault Rifle registration can that old rifle now be registered? Thanks
Unfortunately, no. The new registration period is for guns that were purchased after the previous ban and before 1/1/17. Your friend has a felony in his safe and it will continue to be a felony.
AR15 pistols cannot be featureless because a pistol feature is a magwell outside of the pistol grip. All AR15 pistols will need to be registered or possibly given a fixed magazine device once the DOJ defines what “disassembly of the action” is.
Yes, that is correct. The article has been updated to reflect this. There was originally a typo in the article that said “ar pistols can be made featureless” when I meant to type “cannot”.
Sad enough the states legislaters are exempt from the strict gun laws they have imposed on people , what makes it worse , is to know with out doubt how stupid the California voters are .
Are you SURE that if you register your AR you can use it without a BB? I am hearing mixed replies to this question.
As stated above, I am not a lawyer and nothing here is legal advice. However, an assault weapon is defined as a centerfire, semi-auto rifle with a removable magazine and evil features. Now that the bullet button is defined as a removable magazine, it is no different than a free-state mag release. You can remove the bullet button if you register it as an assault weapon or go featureless.
I asked the gun store about registering and removing the bullet button, he said they haven’t said yet. Whoever “they” are. It may violate 1 of the old assault weapon laws. Does anyone know yet?
“They” is the DOJ who write the regulations for the laws that the legislature passes. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
Can I have Assault features but install the maglock and not register my AR as an AW?
Yes. The article has been updated to more clearly state this. When the article was originally written there was no AR Maglock and the patriot mag release was just a video on the internet. We know a lot more about those devices now.
Be careful.
The Xmas regs say that the bullet button must stay in the rifle it is in when you register.
If you change it back before you register, then you have made an illegal assault rifle that cannot be registered.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
That was vetoed. You can confirm from multiple sources. Here is just one, “AB 1673, authored by Assemblyman Mike Gipson, D-Carson, aimed to eliminate the proliferation of so-called “ghost guns,” which are manufactured at home and currently don’t carry serial numbers.” From http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_30080186/california-gun-laws-jerry-brown-signs-some-new
Correct, AB 1673 was vetoed. But then, on July 22, the Governor signed into law AB 857, another “ghost gun” bill.
AB 857 would require people to apply to the state for serialization and registration after they complete a receiver in their own home.
It doesn’t go into effect until 2018.
It is an unconstitutional law and also, I believe, unenforceable. Additionally, it looks like it is getting challenged in court, and in addition to that, it is one of the bills that people are trying to challenge by referendum (not yet known if that will happen this year or next, but at some point this is likely to appear on the ballot in California).
You can find out more about the effort to overturn AB 857 and other bills, here:
http://www.usacarry.com/forums/california-discussion-and-firearm-news/56938-new-efforts-launched-overturn-unconstitutional-laws-join-us.html
The state is likely going to put something out in late Dec 2016 regarding this. According to SB 880, yes you could do that AFTER you register it in 2017 with the DOJ. However it seems like they are going to put something out at the end of the year which will likely not allow you to remove the BB.
where are you getting your information?
As a heads up. Just picked up my last lower before the new laws go in to effect. I talked with the gun store owner and he said that the DOJ sent out notification that a bullet button will still be required even if you register as an AW. The reasoning being that it was still required at time of purchase and would still be part of the grandfathered law.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
Once California gets all this info on a database then they will do the next step and that is take all of them and then you will have nothing. This is the first step to all of the states. We need to stop this now at all cost if we care about our freedoms.
There is no such thing as a featureless AR pistol because the magazine loads outside of the pistol grip.
You can’t make an AR pistol featureless because of “D”. You have to make it a fixed mag or register it.
So if I add a mag lock devce to an AR pistol does that mean that I don’t have to register it?
Yes, Michael, that is correct. Use the AR Maglock and you don’t have to register.
I have an AR15 that I made from an 80% lower that was registered. My son just turned 18 and I want to give it to him. Found out today is the last day to transfer it to him, but all stores around us will be closed on the 31st… What do I do?? Will I need to wait until 2017, convert it to Featureless and then transfer?
What about the AK47 pistol
Check out the AK MagLatch. That is the only way to keep from registering.
all ar15 pistols have “D”
Huh?
Hey, you seem to know your stuff. I was wondering if I would be able to buy this https://f-1firearms.com/bdr-15-chassis/ in California if I don’t add any evil features to it.
So, if I do not have posession of any upper reciever but still have an finished %80 lower then I am not in posession of an AW?
Buy the way, Ca. Can kiss my ass if they think I would ever register anything.
Just look at what happened in Austrailia, they had every law abiding gun owner on a list.
Ryan.
I moved to CA from. “Free state” where both AR rifles and pistols can have evil features in 2016. I have chosen the featureless on my carbine but als have an AR pistol purchased as a pistol in the free state a couple of years earlier. I have registered my firearms that I brought to CA in accordance with DOJ rules. I do not want to have to register my AR pistol as an AW. Besides a 10 Rd. fixed mag, pinned muzzle brake is there anything else I need to do to keep it compliant? Or will I simply have to register it as an AW and not a pistol?
Can anyone advise me on a firearm legally purchased in December 1993 but unfortunately never registered in any subsequent California assault weapon law. My plan had been to register before December 31, 2017. I would like to possess this legally and use at a local range. The firearm is an H&K SP89 which is a 9mm with a pistol grip, forward handgrip, no fixed magazine. I believe it would have had to comply with a previous registration somewhere back between 1998-2001. Any advice on this firearm would be greatly appreciated. Cheers.
Sure would be nice to get just plain facts without all the drama or ‘advocacy.’ I don’t need to know how you feel (with all the adjectives)–just what the laws state and how that effects my firearms. Is there a site available that just has plain old facts?
Ryan,
If registered as a multi-cal AW after Jan 1st does that mean .50BMG is okay?
Nope. 50 BMG is still illegal as it has been for years now. Nothing in this new law affects 50 BMG. There are different rules regarding assault weapons and 50 BMG. A 50 BMG is not only and “assault weapon.” it has it’s own rules and classifications that are separate and apart from the “assault weapon” BS.
No. .50bmg has been directly banned in California since 2004.
I asked DOJ about getting a 50 BMG upper for my registered lower. I received an email informing me that it is legal. Getting ammo is another matter.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=190502
I understand your point regarding the 50s, but I’m not sure why one would bother going through all that when you can just get a .416 so much more easily, and the behavior of the bullet in flight arguably makes it more desireable than the 50 (though I suppose that’s always debatable). For the AR platform there are uppers that support .416 in single action bolt action as well as semi-auto. I don’t personally know of a drop-in mag available for it (like the Franklin Armory 10-round DFM mag), but it could easily be made.
Can we sell a registered assault rifle out of state after reversing?
Registration
You can sell any rifle out of state regardless of the features or BS California classification. However, if you sell or remove a registered “assault weapon” out of the state, you must make the Cal DOJ aware of this or De-register it before it leaves your possession.
So if I have a house out of the state of California let’s say Washington state do I need to let the doj know that I am taking my guns out of the state?
Hey Ben. This gets into some legal technicalities that I just don’t know how to navigate. Sorry.
Hi gunfighter I have a question for you in “Can I avoid registering my gun as an “assault weapon”? You said you can have a standard mag release on a unregistered featureless ar 15 but then in “Does this mean I can remove my bullet button and use a standard “free state” mag release? You said that I would be committing a felony if I put one on a unregistered featureless ar 15
Read that second section again. I think it is pretty clear. If you have a featureless gun then you can use a standard mag release.
Hi, what’s going on with my mini Ruger 30 or benelli R1? they have detachable magazine and it’s a semi auto.
Thank you
Both the Benelli R1 and the Ruger 30 are featureless as far as I can tell. I’ve never seen one with a pistol grip or collapsable stock. If you have done some aftermarket chassis work or drop them in an aftermarket stock then you could have an assault weapon. There are several versions of those rifles. I would not claim to be an expert on them. If they contain the evil features described above, then they are now considered “assault weapons” in California.
My local Gun shop says the R1 will be on the list that needs to be registered. I am on the fence about buying one if that is the case, on one hand, I want to buy one if I will never have the chance to buy one again, on the other hand, I don’t really want to own/register an “assault rifle” for a variety of reasons. Does anyone know definitively the answer? I read the law and it seems like its a bit of a grey area. My local place just says “it could accept a 10 round mag, so therefore it is.” They also believe the Browning BAR will need to be registered as well.
Ruger makes a mini 14/30 model that comes with a flash suppressor (tactical, I think). Other than that, it is featureless. Regular rifle grip/stock, no forward grip, no grenade launcher.
“Basically, we’ve all be using the bullet button loophole in the law to keep our rifle’s legal and the government just closed that loophole.”
This is not true, it was not a loophole but the specific way the law was worded. There is already a workaround to the new law available, is that a loophole or simply people following the law in the manner it is written and designing things so that we still get some enjoyment from something that wasn’t supposed to be infringed upon in the first place!
You can quibble with my choice of words if you wish. I’m trying to write this article so that people of all skill and knowledge levels can understand it and walk away from it informed. Sometimes I oversimplify an item or two to make it more palatable to one audience or another.
True I very much see your point in over simplifying but it does make it kinda sounds like we’re braking the law, but realistically there braking the original laws by putting these in place. Whole thing frustrates me as a new gun owner in CA.
I believe the term “loophole” is the best description of what the bullet button is under the current state of legislation. You can believe whatever you like but what is written in Sacramento is the law and the bullet button simply circumvents these laws. The gun community in CA has been under attack for as long as I’ve been an adult and wishing it was different won’t help change anything.
Loophole: noun
1.an ambiguity or inadequacy in the law or a set of rules.
“they exploited tax loopholes”
synonyms: means of evasion, means of avoidance; window, gap, opening; “a loophole in the regulations”
Loopholes ARE weaknesses in specific wording of rules. They do involve following the wording. Once the wording is placed into statute, it then becomes operative statutory law. The onlooking public, concerned with compliance, may then note that the specific verbiage allows for an effective workaround called a “loophole”. This means one can exploit a weakness in the verbiage to somehow make the statute work better, or less obnoxiously, for the interested folk in the public. Where you say “people following the law in the manner it is written and designing things so that we still get some enjoyment. . “, you are roughly laying out the basis of a “loophole”. “Loopholes” are neither bad, nor good. They simply demonstrate the difficulty in writing laws so that no workaround can be made.
Here, we could say that converting to “Featureless” is one of a few different “loopholes”. Don’t worry that the term “loophole” sounds bad. It’s not. It’s just a way of describing something fairly complex in a compact form.
Here is another nifty “loophole”, drive that way for a few hours (I am pointing East). Anything that is not spelled out as illegal by law is, by definition, not illegal. That’s the idea of a Republic. It is called enjoying your freedom. Then, you can make your rifle as “evil featured” as you like, once you get into Nevada. Does this mean our government is evil? Since our military and police all have weapons with these features. I have the feeling that we are peasants without a voice, yet again. Don’t tread on me!
What if we drop a .22 LR upper on my lower, is that then exempt??
Yes. The gun is exempt as long as it is a 22lr caliber rifle. The moment you swap the upper or remove the conversion kit, it immediately becomes an “assault weapon” or must be devoid of evil features. You can’t just switch it back and forth form one caliber to another.
What if you switch it back and forth out of state, then bring it back to CA?
As long as it does not include both a removable magazine as they now define it and evil features while it is in California then you should be fine.
Question on 80% AR pistols. Since they dont use a stock. Is pistol grip still ok?
If the pistol has a removable magazine AND any of the other evil features, then it is now considered an “assault weapon” by California law. it only has to have one of those features. It doesn’t need all of them. So, no, the pistol grip is not okay, since it is listed as an evil feature. You must make your AR pistol featureless (including the pistol grip) or register it as an “assault weapon.”
I’m not trying to be an a-hole when ask this, but how many “pistols” of any kind do you know of that don’t have a “pistol grip”? If I am reading the text of the law properly, all semi-automatic pistols that have a “pistol grip” with a detachable magazine, and can accept an over size magazine that extends outside of the magazine well are now illegal under the new laws. The law is so poorly written it’s left me at a loss to try to make any sense of it. The new law pretty much bans all semi-auto hand guns don’t you think?
“Handgun slides like you find on a Glock are exempted. Bottom line, this doesn’t affect your semi-auto 1911/ Glock-style handguns.”
Re-read it. Pistols do no count.
It doesn’t say magazines that extend outside the mag well, it says “the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.”…as in AR/AK pistols…
Seems like the only solution for an AR pistol is the Bullet-Button Reloaded-type of mag release because even if you pin and weld your compensator, your AR pistol is going to have a pistol grip and you’re probably going to need a barrel shroud (hand guard)…unless you’re going to shoot it using an oven mitt on one hand…and that’s not tacticool at all.
or use a crack action mag lock
What if I build an ar pistol with the bb2.0 or Armag-lock? Would that not allow me to keep the features and not register?
Yes. The article has been updated to more clearly state this. When the article was originally written there was no AR Maglock and the Patriot Mag Release was just a video on the internet. We know a lot more about those devices now.
If I use the Franklin Armory DFM and promise to leave the fixed magazine in place at all times, can I keep my evil features and use the standard magazine release?
That is an excellent question and I don’t have a firm answer for it at this time. I think so, but the question really is, “Does opening the AR at the pivot pin constitute ‘disassembly of the action’ by California standards.” I’m efforitng to find that out right now. My guess is “yes”, but I’ll get an answer on that and post a new article in the next few days to confirm.
Check out http://www.armaglock.com/product/armaglock/, same concept as what Prince has. Seems they had mainly marketed to NY but now CA is in the same boat. There may be some precedence set in NY regarding what constitutes disassembly.
So you where mostly talking about the ar15s “evil” features. So how should my ak47 look like to be consider in the good side of the rainbow?
They want us to load our ammo cann with a box full of kittens. Haha
Kittens without claws or teeth. 🙂 No, unfortunately, the AK-style rifles and pistols will be considered “assault weapons” too if they contain any evil features including a pistol grip. You are going to have to make it featureless or register it. In fact, where ARs may be saved by something like the Bullet Button Reloaded, there is no such device for the AK (yet).
Seeing an AK style rifle from the great folks in Las Vegas that made CA compliant AK’s, take close Look at the Arsenal AK mag release area it is cut flush and no way to remove the magazine as it really is on there permanently unless you use the included special tool and at the same token you can remove the cover up top and remove the action and load it to stay legal i am assuming with the new CA laws we are expecting to take effect in 01/2017. Any suggestions if that will suffice both CA laws? Thanks
So from my understanding.
We can keep all our evil featured and free state mag release if the AW is registered correct?
Or we can install the bullet button reloaded and keep all the evil features snd not register the AW correct?
I’m still looking into the option with the BB Reloaded, but all of the above does seem to be the case, yes.
If you register your rifle you will be put in a assault weapons database. Which is very bad cuz sooner or later they will say no more grandfathered rifles tbey are banned now and will know exactly where to go and take them. Over 7 million gun owners in California we need to grow some balls stand up and say screw your re register BS… BOTTOM LINE
under 880, they cant be grandfathered once registered anyway unless their made featureless or a crack action BB is installed, then they can be de-registered
2 Q’s. 1. My son’s and I bought ar 80% lowers and completed them. Obviously not registered. If we add the new magazine release that only works when the barrel is broke, this makes the weapons legal, correct? And, more importantly, must we register them? And if so, if we move those weapons out if CA, do they need to be registered?
2. Mt 15+1 Taurus handgun purchased before the rnd limitations, is it grandfathered? I have my ccw for 33 States, can I carry it legally?
Thx
If you move the guns out of the state then California law cannot touch them. However, they would need to reman out of the state. They are illegal if they come back into the state. The more I am looking into the new Bullet Button Reloaded, the more I am thinking it does qualify as “disassembly of the action” to drop the mag. If you install the new type of bullet button, the guns should be exempt from the law.
You cannot carry a gun concealed in California without a California CCW. Unfortunately, your multi-state permit does not cover California. Carrying a gun in Cali without a Cali CCW is a felony. One of the other new laws that was just signed eliminates all magazines with a capacity of over 10 rounds. Even those that were previously grandfathered in. Legally, you should have that magazine blocked, destroy it, or remove it from the state.
Thank you for the clarity…With the recent Hillary BS, it seems finding a Country she won’t destroy is now necessary.
Gunfighter, questions.
1. Do our 80% now completed lowers legally need to be registered in CA even if they have the Bullet Button Reloaded option?
2. Can I take the AR’s out of State to shoot and bring them back after our vacation?
3. Working on my CA CCW in a County other than the Liberal Left L.A.
Thank you again!
Guns built on 80% lowers still have to follow the same rules as serialized guns. The basic rule is, if it needed a bullet button before SB880, then it is an “assault weapon” after SB880. You’r 80% guns are no exception.
You can travel out of state with your guns and come back in without a problem. However, if you move out of state (set up residence in another state) then you cannot bring the guns back into California if you decide to move back into this state.
Following your statement, does the 80% lower require a serial number registered with DOJ if being used, as either a featureless or compliant (Non AWR weapon)?
It’s not necessarily a felony. Actually, in most cases, unless someone isn’t legal to even possess or own a firearm, it’s a misdo.
My understanding is as follows: it’s a felony if the firearm is not registered in CA, a misdemeanor if it is registered.
So if i have a built lower with no upper attached is it still considered an AW? I know this sounds stupid but but if my only intent was to have the weapon for the purposes of protection in the event the shit hits the fan……..
There is a legal concept known as “constructive possession” which basically means that if you have all of the parts for a thing (assembled or not) then you possess that thing. Example: if you have a rifle lower with no upper attached and a pistol upper not attached to a lower, then you can be charged with possession of an SBR(short barreled rifle)
Ain’t our legal system great?
Yeah, everything Molon Labe stated is correct. In addition, remember that your lower is the gun. If you have an assembled lower with a removable magazine and a pistol grip or telescoping stock, then you have an assault weapon even if the upper isn’t attached.
Gunfighter: Maybe a little more clarity on the definition you stated above or a link to the reference that states the mere possession of a lower is defined as an assault weapon. The reason I ask is because by definition it isn’t an assault weapon unless it is first a semi-automatic firearm.
I ask because if I register a semi-automatic firearm under the new laws, I can always remove the semi-auto upper, install a single-shot upper where a bolt pull is required to cycle the action (ie. gas tube and gas block removed), leave all the remaining “evil features” installed, De-Register it and then transfer the weapon a family member or sell it. At least thats my plan forward.
Yeah, LowBux you’re going to have to consult an attorney for clarification on that. It is my understanding that if you have an assembled lower with evil features and a bullet button or free state mag release then it is an assault weapon, even if there is no upper attached. Remember that California requires all gun sellers to state the “type” of gun when the gun is DROSed. Stripped lowers are always classified as “semi-automatic” at the time of purchase in California. That means your lower is considered to be a semi-automatic gun. If you later modify it to a bolt action, that is fine, but until you put that bolt action upper on the lower it is still considered to be a semi-auto gun.
How about a Kriss Vector 16″ carbine? Would this be considered a assault weapon under their new description?
If it needed a bullet button before this law was passed, then it is an “assault weapon” after the law is passed. The Kriss has a pistol grip. If it also has a removable magazine under the definition of the new law, then it is an assault weapon.
so 80% lower with a 22LR conversion bolt carrier group and im good to go legally?
Yes. The 22 conversion kit will prevent your gun from being classified as an “assault weapon.” However, you are running dangerously close to a concept known as “constructive possession” (as Molon Labe mentioned above). This basically means that if you have all of the parts for a thing (assembled or not) then you possess that thing. If your 22LR conversion kit is installed and you have a 5.56 upper, then you are going to have a tough time if those guns ever get confiscated or if you are ever stopped and have both in your car.
I would check the roll marks on your lower because if it is stamped 5.56,223,6.8 or Multi Cal I don’t think it would matter what upper or conversion kit you have on it. They would go by the caliber markings on the lower. So you would still have a so called assault weapon. Better make sure or you can loose your gun rights.
james, sorry but your wrong. i ske to DOJ in length about this, and was specifically told by them that if you change your AR over to rimfire, it makes no difference whatsoever what the lower says , as they go by the CALIBER THAT THE GUN IS SHOOTING AT THE TIME. so if yu have a milti caliber lower and install a 22 rimfire kit, your 100000% LEGAL and it DOES NOT require registration , and you can have all the evil features you like.
Do you know if this applies to New York as well?
Thanks for the info. Would be good to educate folks on AW transport for those who decide to register.
BTW, you wrote “17 years” but you meant 27.
I’ll touch on the AW transport regulations as soon as I can.
Sir,can I register now my Ar15? What is the web site? Thanks
The DOJ has yet to release a finalized list of regulations and the website. Wait until they publish the final regulations and it will contain that info.
What if I had a lower purchased at a gun show in Texas, then moved to CA. Do I get it on CA DOJ somehow?
When did you move to California? If it was after January 1, 2014 then, technically, you were supposed to register the gun within 60 days of moving into the state. You currently have an unregistered firearm. Not the end of the word, but this law will apply to your lower regardless of when or where you bought it. If you have a stripped lower, you need to decide if you are going to register it as an assault weapon, build it as a featureless build, use a new type of bullet button, or just ignore the law entirely. Each has it’s own pros and cons and only you can decide what is right for you.
Just to clarify, you say in the article several times that “you are guilty of a felony”, but then you say it’s punishable by less than a year in jail. In California, MISDEMEANORS are punishable by less than a year, felonies by more than a year.
It sounds like these violations are indeed misdemeanors, not felonies. Perhaps the article should be corrected to reflect that.
The actual text of the law states, “Existing law requires that any person who, within this state, possesses an assault weapon, except as otherwise provided, be punished as a felony or for a period not to exceed one year in a county jail.” The key word there is “or.” My guess is that it would be up to the individual DA’s office as to what someone would be charged with.
That would make it a “Wobbler” in Cal. law – police generally enforce (i.e. arrest) wobblers as felonies, but as Gunfighter pointed out, it’s up to the DA’s office on how the case gets filed. Certain variables like prior criminal history, the act in which the possessor was involved in when possession was discovered, etc, will likely determine filing, and ultimately sentencing upon a conviction.
Also, keep in mind, the lawmakers goals aren’t to put people in jail but to prevent gun ownership. By making every gun violation a felony they hope to convict essentially law abiding gun owners of these essentially petty laws so the gun owner will be a convicted felon and will no longer be allowed to own firearms. Which is why it’s essential to be vigilant on the laws!
As Ayn Rand said, “Laws aren’t worth passing unless the right people break them.”
AB109 changed the definition of a felony. Felonies can now be sentenced to county jails.
What about AK rifles and AK pistols? Do they have to be registered due to this new law?
Yes. AK-style guns, just like ARs, are considered “assault weapons” if they meet the new definition. AKs are actually tougher because they can’t make use of something like the new brake action bullet button.
How would an FN PS90 be affected by the BB ban?
That is a really good question. My standing answer has been “if it needed a bullet button before this law passed, then it is an assault weapon after this law passed.” I’m honestly not sure if they PS90 would be considered featureless.
PS90 includes a “thumb-hole” stock, is semi-auto center fire and mag loads outside of the grip… I’d say it’ll either be banned, or HAVE to be a registered AW. There’s absolutely no way to break it down for reloading.
Yes, what Robert said.
If we wanted to register an “assault weapon” then when could we so we can put the mag release back on?
I guess you could to it right now, but you are not required to do so until January 1, 2018. A process for it exists. Personally, I’ve never registered an assault weapon. My understanding is that it is just a form you fill out and send it with a check for $20. However, the new law calls for an online submission process.
I would not remove the BB until you have it registered as an AW. Otherwise, you will have an unregistered AW per the old law, which required registration sometime in the past.
Wait until it is a registered AW before removing the BB.
It’s really retarded that the let millions of AWs that were no “AWs” and required a BB and slower mag exchange times to become easier to reload, but that is stupid liberal short-sighted hoplophobic thinking for you.
Yes. Good point, Jason. I’d wait until i had written confirmation of the registration before removing the bullet button.
Can we remove the longer muzzle break on a Tavor to meet the min 30″ requirement if we register it as an assault weapon?
John Drake, my website software won’t let me reply to your comment. I really don’t know the answer to that question. You’d have to consult with an attorney on that.
Does this affect M1A’s??
Only those with a flash hider. If you put a comp on it, then you should be fine.
the gun shop i went today said that you have to register m1a’s.
is that true?
Only if it has “evil features.” If you have a comp instead of a flash hider then you should be fine.
Thank you for the article. Are we able to register an AR15 as a “assault weapon” without any hassle? I am not law enforcement and I have no practical use for the gun. I don’t want to register, be denied, and then be ordered to destroy it. I guess what I’m asking is: Are there stringent qualifications to register and possess an assault weapon? It seems like there would be.
Well, I have never registered an “assault weapon,” so I have no hands on experience with the process. Just what I have read. My understanding is that it is just a form. You are not applying for the designation. The form simply alerts the state that you have the gun. I don’t think there is a process by which they would “reject” the form.
For this new law there are now requirements for owning one aside from the current laws on owning a gun. If you’re registering a full auto or semi-auto center fire rifle with a detachable magazine (no bullet button), it is illegal as you missed the previous registration in 2000. In this case you would be required to surrender or destroy the firearm(s).
If you’re talking about registering a semi-auto center fire rifle with a bullet button, as long as it has a bullet button, is not full auto, and has an overall length of 30″ or more you will have no problem registering it under the new law
I know this is a dumb question but the ar stock on the picture, who makes that?
I believe that stock is the FRS 15. it has been used on New York guns since they passed a similar law a couple of years ago. I’ve never seen one in person.
It’s made by Thordsen Custom of out San Francisco.
MGI has them for sale.Just give them a call. I purchased one a few months ago for the express purpose of building a “non-evil” CA compliant AR-15.
Off the topic. My question is in regards to reloading Ammo and buying reloading materials. Will this be allowed? Under the new Ammo laws.
I am still looking into that new law and I will be releasing an article on it later in the week. So far, I have not seen anything in it that mentions reloading supplies. However, I’m not very far into it.
Bullets are listed as part of the law. So you will be able to buy everything except bullets without a background check, etc. You can always mine the backstops for lead and make your own bullets.
Are you SURE that if you register your AR you can use it without a BB? I am hearing mixed replies to this question.
Yes. Once it is registered as an “assault weapon” then you can have a removable magazine. Remember, in the eyes of the new law, the free-state mag release and the bullet button that we have all come to know are the exact same thing. They both qualify as a removable mag.
Doesn’t the new law state that you are not allowed to modify the AW after it has been registered? You definitely can’t do it before it is registered because then you would be violating current law because you no longer have a BB. Also the new law requires that you list the unique features of the AW.
If that is the case then I would suggest to list it as having a removable mag and leave it at that since in the eyes of the new law there is no difference between having a bb and a free state mag release anymore. Both would fall under the same line item of the bill and from what I have read there is no distinction between the two once the new law takes effect on 1JAN2017 IMHO. But I am not a lawyer.
NO, there is nothing in sb880 that says that you can not modify the firearm once it is registered.
I could not find anything from the 89 registration that says so either.
If anyone has a link legislature that says this, please post it.
After market modifications aren’t regulated by the state, or they have no “legal opinion on the that.” What you definitely cannot do is change the caliber or the weapon. If you previously registered an AW in 2000 with a 5.56 caliber, once you change the caliber it is a different gun and at that point illegal.
I believe the same is also true of the barrel length, that must remain the same.
Jason: This is a curious situation. I never registered a weapon during the previous AWB, but in this case I was planning on registering the lower as MULTI_CAL as that is what is stated on the lower. And I would add that the calibers would be .223, 5.56 and 6.5 Grendel.
And I would guess the barrel length would have to be strictly defined for each gun as you stated, so each of my three lowers for example would get a 16, 18 and 24 inch barrel respectively assigned to them.
Currently that is the case, but they are working on something that will be put out at the end of the year regarding this. It appears as though they’re coming up with something and the language will not allow you to remove a BB after you register it. However there is nothing on this yet, but I would keep a close eye out in late December 2016.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
What if I want to go hunting out of state for 10 days? Can I bring my evil gun back home?
Yes. You can leave the state with the gun and come back home. You cannot move out of state and then come back with the gun.
Can I just send my AR 15 back home, to Texas, before 2018
Yes. Once it is out of the state then California law can’t touch it.
So what about a Benelli M4 with pistol grip? Also, can you clarify if gun trusts might assist with keeping weapons in family after owner dies?
I am afraid that is above my pay grade. I don’t know enough about trusts to answer the questions properly. You should speak with a trust attorney.
Shotguns are now considered assault weapons if they have a removable magazines, are semi auto, and have some evil features like a pistol grip and telescoping stock. I have not seen a lot of M4s with removable magazines, but I know there are some aftermarket stock conversion kits that do add a mag. As long as your M4 does not have a removable magazine then it is fine.
What if I live close to the border with Free America and store my illegal weapons there and never bring them back to the PRK? If I don’register them am I still guilty of a felony?
As long as the guns are not in the state then California law cannot touch them. If they cross the state line and come back into Cali, then you have committed a felony.
Great article… Thanks. One point is confusing though, from the paragraph pasted below.
“What about 80% Lowers?
Same as above. Your AR rifle or AR pistol built on an 80% is an “assault weapon” if it contains any of the evil features described above. If you wish to keep those evil features on your gun, then you are required to serialize it and register it with the Cal DOJ before January 1, 2018. If you make it featureless, then you are fine.”
If I use the new Bullet Button Reloaded on an 80% lower and still have the other evil features, why would I have to register it with the CDOJ? I was under the impression that the law requiring home made rifles to have a CDOJ issued serial number didn’t make it passed the Governor.
Am I missing something?
I am still trying to understand if the BB Reloaded meets the definition of “disassembly of the action.” My guess is that it does. If you install the BB Reloaded then you re likely okay, but I will know more about that soon.
@ Dave: no, you are not missing anything. I have read from multiple sources the ghost gun bill was vetoed. You do not have to register a homemade weapon, which of course includes an 80% lower built into a full AR.
The “Ghost Gun” bill was vetoed in previous years, but Gov. Brown did sign it (AB857) into law on July 7th, 2016. You do have to register your 80% in California now. As of 1/12/2017 the DOJ has not released details on how you should go about doing that.
To my knowledge if you either put the new BB reloaded or leave it featureless then you are still NOT required to register the 80% lower (finished or not). You are correct that the specific bill that required all 80% lowers (finished or not) to be registered and serialized was vetoed by the governor.
The Ghost Gun bill was signed into law. If it has no evil features, you will have to register it as a ghost gun, but you will not have to register it as an assault weapon. You will still be permitted to take it places other than your residence/range/etc that are subject to location/transport restrictions on assault weapons.
One of the bills vetoed attempted to declare an unfinished 80% receiver as a firearm. So it appears (and I must stress that word) that an unfinished 80% receiver does not need to be registered as a ghost gun unless/until you convert it into a finished firearm.
This pretty much means it’s time to relocate to a gun friendly Free America State. California’s Anti-gun legislature impedes law abiding gun owners to protect themselves and family members by these oppressive gun control laws while at the same time these Hypocritical Legislators exempt themselves from these draconian “feel good but do nothing” anti-gun laws
Amen, brother.
Please enlighten the shroud issue in relation to an AR. My understanding is the shroud is now an evil feature. So even with a locked mag the shroud or in those case a hand guard still makes the ar an AW?? So even if you remove all the evil features your still SOL due to the handguard. Is this correct?
Yes, but that applies only to AR/ AK-style pistols. Not AR/ AK rifles. The handguard is an evil feature on a pistol. Your AR pistol will need to be registered, or you can use the new Bullet Button Reloaded, or you can ignore the law entirely. There are risks to the latter, but the decision is yours to make. AR pistols are going to be tough to be made featureless. I may need to go back and edit the paragraph regarding pistols to clarify that.
Do not comply. Be a man and stand up for your God given (not state given) rights.
Yeah, my goal in this article was to let people know what their options are. I didn’t state that one of the options is to just ignore the law, but I should have. I was trying to keep emotion out of the article and try to state everything rather matter-of-factly (not sure if that is a word). When New York and Connecticut passed a similar law a few years ago 90% of gun owners just ignored the law. That is certainly an option, but I hope people will take the time to understand the risks involved in that course of action and walk that path with eyes wide open. I’ll write another article later this week or this weekend to discuss the pros and cons/ risks of non-compliance.
You forgot to mention option C. If all gun owners stand as a unified front, and together we change, modify, register, or surrender NOTHING, then enforcement becomes impossible.
Yeah Jamie. You are right. See my comment above. My goal in this article was to keep emotion out of it. I will write another article in the next few days that discusses the pros and cons of non-compliance in more detail.
Gunfighter, I am a new gun owner. I purchased my handgun(for home defense) from your store. Lee was very knowledgeable and understanding of my situation. I’m dealing with gang members vandalizing and scouting my work van(it holds all of my tools, basically my lively hood). I’ve chased them away in the middle of the night once already. I fear a handgun isn’t enough. I feel the need for a rifle and I want an AR. If I purchase a AR will the DOJ now know I own an “assault weapon” or is it up to me to tell them? I don’t agree with the registration and I’m willing to risk not registering it. Thank you
Matt, I am sorry that I am just now seeing this question. We try to answer questions on Facebook within a couple of hours, but I don’t check this website as often. It’s just too much to keep up with. To be clear, you should not shoot someone to protect property. You should shoot someone to protect life. That said, the best weapons to incapacitate a person are rifles and shotguns. They work far better than handguns. However, I would strongly encourage you to have a low deductible on the van and make sure you are well insured. You don’t want to shoot someone to protect those tools. Trust me, you don’t want to live with that on your conscience for the rest of your life.
Ok so just a few things I would like to add.
1- Pistols are exempt. This includes AR and AK pistols, and anything else that was initially built as a pistol. You can still make pistol versions of rifles from 80% lowers with no registration, but I f you put a forward grip or a flash hider on it without pin and weld, it is now an SBR and you’re a felon.
2- Trying to register your rifle as an AW is the most retarded idea I hear going around, as you all just gave them the chance they needed to deny it, get your information, and confiscate. Look how long it takes to get a form 2 through the ATF, CADOJ is even messier, and if there’s one day when you don’t have approval, you’re fucked, as in going to prison.
3- SB880 is not an addendum to the 80’s AW ban, for which extension was voted against and therefore expired, but this is an entirely new law. The evil features debate you brought up is completely invalid.
None of that is correct. You are welcome to read the law if you’d like http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=201520160AB1135.
AR and AK-style pistols are not exempt. Under section 1, items 4 and 5 very clearly define these pistols as “assault weapons.” Furthermore, registering your gun as an “assault weapon” is a registration, not an application. It’s not like you are applying for a job. They don’t reject it. You fill out a form to notify them of your possession of that type of weapon. It’s not an application process. I’m not encouraging anyone to register, I find the whole process to be completely insulting, unconstitutional, and Orwellian.
Regarding the evil features. Just read the law. I am not making this stuff up. In Section 1 items 1 through 8 clearly define evil features for rifles, pistols, and shotguns.
The law is only about 3 printed pages long. Just read it.
Is a Prince 50 Mag lock still an option? It cane out before the BB. You would still have to open the gun to load the magazine.
I am honestly not sure. I wish I had more, but I really don’t know.
The magazine must not be ejectable unless the receiver is opened. If that is how you have configured it, it’s legal. I don’t have much experience with the Prince 50, but from the looks of it, the BB Reloaded seems to parrot it.
The goal of lawmakers was to dramatically increase the time between reloads on weapons with evil features. They certainly have accomplished that goal.
Yes. The article has been updated to more clearly state this. When the article was originally written there was no AR Maglock and the Patriot Mag Release was just a video on the internet. We know a lot more about those devices now.
How are M1 carbines affected? Mine is standard, no mods.
If it is one of the models with a flash hider then it has an evil feature. If it has a comp then it is fine. Let me know if you have any other questions on this.
Just need clarification… the “Standard M1A” (Model MA9109) is a mag fed center fire firearm and wouldn’t be affected by this law as long as it has a comp? So the only “evil” feature on this rifle is the flash surpressor? Or is this model already fitted with a comp? Confused…
Great article, btw. Thanks for writing it.
All of the pictures I see of the model MA9109 in my distributor websites and on Google clearly show a flash hider, not a comp. You’ll want to change that flash hider to a comp. The rule of thumb is that if the vents run parallel to the barrel then it is a flash hider. If the vents run perpendicular to the barrel then it is a comp.
What will registering our so called AW do for the government, will it give them the right to confiscate my firearm when they want to?
Gun control isn’t about controlling guns. It is about controlling people. I can think of only one reason a government wants you to register a gun and that is so they know where the guns are when it comes time to take them.
Am I to understand that when you by a gun in CA a copy of the paperwork stays with DOJ. Thats seems like registration to me in that they know what you bought and your address.
DROS (dealer record of sale) at the time of purchase and Assault Weapons Registration are two different things.
So if I have an ar pistol and I put the stock on it like you have shown in the featureless pic would that be considered legal or would that make it a sbr?
It would still have a barrel shorter than 16″, that makes it an SBR covered by the NFA
As Stuart said, that would be a violation of the NFA and would land you in federal prison. Given that an AR handguard is now considered an evil feature, there really is no way to make an AR pistol featureless. Your best bet is to use the new Bullet Button Reloaded.
What about a hi point 9mm carbine rifle? It’s a covered hand gun with a bullet button. Do I have to register that type of rifle?
Yes. That is a evil featured gun. The basic rule of thumb is, if it needed a bullet button before the law was passed, then it is an “assault weapon” after the law is passed. This is going to be a tricky one because the Bullet Button Reloaded will not work with that gun.
If the registered AW is in your spouse name can you take the AW to the range or hunting without them
I do not believe so, but I honestly don’t know about immediate family. I am creating a list of questions to ask the DOJ when I call them late this week or early next and will report what I’ve found in this or another article.
Not anymore. Prior to 2014 (the Sandy Hook wave of laws), the law permitted transfers between family members upon death – so spouses were tacitly permitted to share. But not anymore.
I think there is a compelling 2A case for people who have registered AW’s to inherit their family member’s AW’s – but it would cost a lot to fight the DOJ in court to win that one.
Even the looney left Supreme Court in this state would have a tough time arguing the state has a compelling interest to deny inheritance of an AW, if you already are entrusted by the state with your own AW.
But again, you’d have to have the cash to fight. And then you draw the ire (and investigations) of the state AG. Which is why most with money, won’t sue over things like this, and just move their inherited AW’s to their villa in Vegas.
Would I be allowed to buy a scar 17 IF they made a “cal compliant” version with the new “bullet button reloaded” or does this law ban Merton ever buying a new semi auto rifle again. I ask because as of right now scar 17s are impossible to find!
Well, if they make a version with the new bullet button, then it is not classified as an “assault weapon” and would be exempt from the law. You would be fine. Don’t hod your breath though. It seems a stretch that they will have a version this that feature any time soon. You may find a private seller outside of California that would be willing to install one for you and send it into the state.
Would you rather register and switch to quick mag release, or go featureless?
Bob, honestly, everyone is going to have to come to that conclusion on their own and for my own safety I am going to politely decline to answer. I will say, though, that you can switch to a free-state mag release if you register OR if you go featureless.
Personally, I’m doing both. I have one AR-15 receiver that I plan to register, and one that I won’t. The former will be built out, the latter will be featureless.
Then if I need one for self-defense, I can pop it in a case in my trunk and drive it with me. The AW version will stay at home.
If someone breaks into my house, I would much rather have the pistol grip at 3 AM so I don’t shoot a family member as the gun slips, half-awake.
I just bought a s&w ar15 on July 29,2016. Do I have to register it as an aw?
Also, when I die, is it just my Ar that has to be turned in? Or all of my guns?
Sorry, June 19th
Only registered “assault weapons” die with you. Any pistol, shotgun, rifle, etc. that does not meet the definition of an “assault weapon” and hasn’t been registered is fine to be inherited by your spouse or kids. The S&W AR15 does have evil features. You’ll need to either register it, make it featureless, or install the new Bullet Button Reloaded.
So if they are calling my rifle an “assult rifle” and telling me to register it. Can I make it an sbr or get a silencer?!?
No. SBRs and silencers are regulated by the feds too and they have their own set of rules and regulations on them. You cannot turn your gun into an NFA gun just because it is a registered “assault weapon”. An “assault weapon” by Cali definition and an NFA gun are not the same thing.
Thanks, great article.
@gunfighter. I have a very similar and a little more specific question on that same sibject of CA AW and a NFA SBR/supressor build. I understand that they are totally different laws and one is a state issue while the other is federal but I would like to know what the opportunities are now with this new law comming to effect and the order in which they would need to be accomplished if they are even possible. If I first register my AR-15 as a CA AW can I then apply to the NFA to then get it also registered as an SBR and/or supressed rifle and still be CA legal since it is now already registered as an AW in CA? Because prior to this new law it is my understanding that no new AW could be registered in CA pretty much at all for the past decade-and-a-half any way which would include SBRs and supressed rfiles so even if you could get your gun registered with the NFA as an SBR and/or supressed rifle it would still not be CA legal unless it was already registered as such in CA a long time ago. But now that there will be a whole new wave of CA legal AWs being registerd I was hoping to be able find a way take full advantage of that. So i guess my exact questiom is: Would it be possible to fill out the CA AW paperwork, pay those fees and then fill out the NFA SBR and/or supressor paperwork and pay those fees for the same gun so that I could have a CA legal AW that is now also a NFA registered SBR and/or supressed rifle? If it is at all possible to do such a thing what order would the paperwork need to be filled out in? CA AW first then Fed NFA? Or Fed NFA first then CA AW? Or CA AW and Fed NFA simultaneously? I am aware that legally no physical mods should be made to the gun until the new law os im effect and all paperwork is submitted, filed and/or approved. If this issue is too down in the weeds for an answere right away please have it be on the list of questions to ask the CA DOJ the next tome you talk to them because I have a lot of friends wondering the same thing.
Guns on the NFA list almost certainly require you to get a Dangerous Weapons permit from the CA DOJ. They are no longer issuing those (except in very rare circumstances) as the courts said they don’t have to.
In other words, don’t worry about it, because you can’t do it, because the state won’t let you.
This really sucks for competitive shooters not only for the people living here in the state but now the people coming from out of state won’t be able to bring in their rifles so all the major matches in California are no longer going to exist anymore. What a way to kill businesses.
Killing businesses is what Socialists do best.
With Gov Turd signing these BS bills, …are they officially coming into law as of Jan 1st, or are they to be voted on come Nov? Thanks gunfighter
No. They are law. He has already signed them into law. Gavin Newsom’s group of super Socialists do have some anti-gun measures on the ballot, but the outcome of those ballot measures will not affect these laws in any way.
I will not submit. Period. What I keep in my own home is MY business. What I shoot in public will be discreetly done and I will continually carry concealed as I see fit, without a permit. I am not a sheep. I am willing to die for my rights as those before me and will not comply. I will not worry about jail, fines, etc., and instead live freely up until the end. F*ck registration.
There are many who support you and will act in the same manner. Good luck, V. My guess is that this kind of stuff is going to get worse before it gets better.
I’m with you,V. Live free or die. I learned a lot during the civil rights revolution growing up in New Orleans. One of the more effective non-violent ways to get rid of bad laws is massive civil disobedience ala M.L.King. But ya gotta be ready to do some time in the slammer.
How is law enforcement effected if they own an AR with all of the evil goodies on it?
Well, that’s a good question. Cops can own any handgun they wish, unlike us little people. The government saw fit to exempt itself from those laws that we must follow. “Assault weapons” are a different story. Cops can only have a rifle without a bullet button if they are using it in their official duties. My guess is that they will need to follow this law (SB 880) unless the gun is for official use.
Please just hold on to your britches until she CA DOJ has had the opportunity to review and comment on the new laws. Should they remain as is there are many options available to avoid registering some rifles as assault weapons. I am a gunsmith who has an internal solution that is sound and affordable for the ar15 platform. I will not release or discuss this solution until required. It does not require any external devices and will be 100% compliant. Don’t panic. We are working on other platforms as well.
gunfighter – If an AR15 .223 was to be converted to .22lr via a conversion kit or dedicated .22lr upper, would all the evil feature including the standard mag release put this gun into the “assult weapon” class? Since the .22lr is rimfire?
All rimfire guns, including 22lr guns, are exempt. This law only applies to centerfire rifles. However, you’ll need to be careful of something called “Constructive intent.” That basically means that if you have all of the parts to make a thing, then you essentially own that thing. For instance, you can be charged with bomb making if you own all the parts to make a bomb, but haven’t actually constructed it into a bomb yet. If you own all of the parts for a 5.56 rifle then you own the 5.56 rifle. Again, I don’t claim to be an attorney and nothing here is legal advise, but you should read up on “Constructive intent.”
Is there any state as crazy as California, I visit because of the amusement parks and the weather. But before you decide to live there maybe you should see a shrink. The give sanctuary to illegal aliens, they give driver licenses to illegal aliens, they let illegal aliens become lawyers (even though they are breaking the law), and they get state benefits. So why would anyone in their right mind want to move to California and give up their weapons (protection).
Will, yup, we are totally F’d Up in Cali…
If I didn’t have kids and future grand kids living hear I would move to another country like TEXAS!. There you get a high five and a commendation for protecting yourself, your family and property. Democracy historically is good for 200 years… we are either moving towards Socialism or Revolution…. I vote for the later. Wish us luck!
Question regarding the 30″ length requirement. Would registering something like a ps90 or steyr Aug as an ‘assault weapon’ allow me to remove the extra length devices and go back to the federal requirement of only 26″? Any ideas on that? Or will the 30″ length requirement still persist even on something registered as an ‘assault weapon’. Please note, I am not talking about SBR’s. I know the difference.
I don’t think so. Other California laws don’t stop applying just because you register it as an assault weapon. Now, that said, I am not 100% sure of that and this is not legal advice. I believe California is still going to define a rifle to be 30″ or greater.
The 30″ OAL requirement is a byproduct of the AWCA. Once registered as an AW the only things (with respect to lengths) are the 16″ barrel and and 26″ OAL to avoid both Federal and State SBR regulations.
First off wanted to thank you for you time answeeing questions and concern californians have with the gunpocalypse. Wanted to ask you sir if a highpoint 995ts and 4595ts (with BB). According to highpoint website it is categorized as a carbine, my problem so far is I can’t find anything similar to armaglock. Are they considered an aw also? Or exempted? Thanks on advance for your time and effort to educate some of us law abiding citizen.
The basic rule is, “if it needed a bullet button before SB880, then it is an assault weapon after SB880.” By California definition the HP carbines are “assault weapons.”
Question regarding pistols and AW registration…If a semi-auto center-fire pistol were converted so that it operated using a bullet button style release, could a threaded barrel then be installed, and the pistol registered as an “assault weapon” during the registration window? Then after it is registered, the bullet button replaced with the standard magazine release?
Once your pistol is registered as an assault weapon, then you don’t need the bullet button and you can have a threaded barrel. Did I misunderstand your question? If so, please respond and I’ll answer.
I think you understood my question. I have an FNX-45 Tactical that isn’t legal with the threaded barrel it came with. I’m thinking about converting it to use a bullet button, installing the threaded barrel, registering it, then removing the bullet button. It will save me from getting an aftermarket non-threaded barrel. Thanks for your reply!
First time here by way of FB. Gunfighter – thank you for fielding all these questions. Please bill Sacramento for the Q&A you’ve done here.
I have several AR15 and AR10 rifles with adjustible stocks. Can I just epoxy the stock so that it will not move thus removing one of the evil characteristics?
Yep. As long as it does not telescope, then it is NOT considered to be an evil feature.
Is the penalty for using a hi-cap mag in either a registered or unregistered AR the same as possessing one, an infraction?
I’m honestly not sure. I’ll be looking into the new standard capacity mag band soon.
I know for a fact that the Sheriff’s department is aware of each and every gun I buy, as I forgot to bring the serial number with me when I needed to add a Glock 19 to my CCW, and they had it on record. So, if the Sheriff knows about all my weapons, then the CA DOJ and the Feds must also know, so what is the difference in “registering” my AWs as required? Isn’t this just another redundant list, and if the DOJ decides to ‘confiscate’ all AWs in the future, then wont they know where to find mine by referencing the other ‘lists”? Maybe this is the last way to get rid of those darned bullet buttons and go for a free state mag release, to enjoy my ‘modern rifles’ with only the 10 round magazine as the limitation. Your thoughts?
Making people line up for redundant shit is what Socialists do best. Of course they already know where the guns are. We’ve been DROSing guns for years. This is just another redundant step to try and criminalize gun ownership.
There seems to be enough paper trail on any firearm bought through an FFL. So shouldn’t it be a concern that if they know what firearms/receivers you have purchased in the past they could match the list of what you have purchased and what you have registered (or not registered) and scream “gotcha”? Guess they would have to check up on you and see if you have BBd or gone featureless.
I think it is more about collecting another registration fee, and such from millions of gun users is what drives these bills more then to solve any gun related crimes.
If you read their bills it clearly stated that they are going to create more criminals, by creating these laws.
Nice!
Paying the DROS fees is not enough. How can they fix it so the law abiding gun owners fork over more of their hard earned cash? Easy, make some rule to re-register their guns, then once labeled as an Assault Weapon ( which is a far fetched definition of a semi automatic rifle that NO MILITARY personal will take into battle because it lacks features of a TRUE assault weapon ) One can’t sell, or pass on after death to next of kin. Sad fact.
I am not sure who gave these law makers the ability to redefine a duck into a chicken, but ladies and gents, that is exactly what they did, and collected our tax dollars as a paycheck for this deed. If I did this at my work, I would be fired for misleading the public, and stealing money from the people of California for passing a law that will not solve a single gun related crime. Even if they find a gun and locate the original purchaser, this will not point to the person who stole the gun from that individual 4 years prior.
Lets just wait till 2017, when law abiding gun enthusiasts are going to have to file for permits to buy ammunition, and of course these cards will probably cost a pretty penny.
Oh yeah, those pesky large cap magazines the government wants you to throw them away destroy them…. How about offering a fair price value for these high cap magazines like $75 for each turned in? How about offering free registration of the rifles with the ability to pass to next of kin, or sell later?
And of course why should the people enjoying the sport of target shooting have to move out of state? Why not the people who make up stupid laws to create more criminals?
One last thing…. It would be interesting to see millions of people lined up demanding to be arrested, and fed, and clothed, and entertained in jail at tax payers expense just to prove a point that they can’t afford it, nor do they have the facility to handle such undertaking.
So if i add the bullet button reloaded, I can keep all the other evil features and still keep it UNregistered, correct? Also im afraid that constantly removing the rear take down pin might ruin the uppers pin hole.
Yes, that is correct. It does seem like a lot of unnecessary wear and tear, doesn’t it?
And slamming the BCG closed on an empty chamber just to be able to open the action every time you reload.
Just be glad that you dont have to register the upper. You can at least replace it! Not the best solution but…..
If I register my AR pistol as an assault weapon, can I put a collapseable stock on it, pay the SBR tax with the ATF, and legally own/operate the now classified SBR in California?
No. Those are totally different things. The ATF will never approve a tax stamp for an SBR in California. SBRs are illegal in California, period.
Okay, so if I use a monsterman grip with A2 stock, and do not have any evil features, I can use my AR without the BB? Also, does a mag well grip count as a forward grip in the letter of the law, according to your interpretation?
Again, I am not an attorney, but I think a magwell grip is a pretty ugly grey area. Personally, I would not use one. Just grasp the magwell without a grip. Again, just my opinion. It is correct that you do not need to use a bullet button if the rifle is featureless.
Thank you for your insight, and I understand that you are not giving legal advice, just your layman’s interpretation of the law as it currently reads.
Time to go!
I have a question regarding purchasing stripped lowers. It sounds as if we will not be able to purchase them after Jan 1 due to them being able to be built as an “AW” or does that mean that they would now have to be sold in such a way as to be preconfigured to not classify as an AW? For example, only be sold with the BBR already installed (assuming the BBR fits legal definition).
Yes. That is correct. You can still buy lowers after January 1, 2017, but they will have to be built featureless or use the new bullet button.
or be built as a rimfire!
Gunfighter: Again, this answer seems to conflict with Constructive Intent. I would be surprised if you could still buy stripped lowers AFTER Jan 1st 2017. I bought stripped lowers BEFORE Dec 21, 2016 with the intent of registering the lowers as AW’s in 2017 and building them up in any configuration any time after that.
We are still selling stripped lowers. As far as constructive intent, yes, depending on the other things you own, you could be running into constructive intent issues.
Great article.
Can I buy 5 stripped lowers before January 1, 2017, register them before 2018 as Assault Weapons, and then leisurely buy uppers and other evil features whenever I feel like it?
I have this same question
can any one help?
Yes. That is fine. You can buy now and build later. As long as you have them on the books by 1/1/17 and registered by 1/1/18, you are fine.
So I am building an AR-15 with an original bullet button installed. I should have it finished before the end of this year, 2016. I don’t plan on registering it as an “assault weapon” and I just want to know when exactly I need get the new bullet button reloaded, by Jan 1, 2017 or Jan 1, 2018?
I have this same question
can any one help?
You will need the new bullet button reloaded installed by 1/1/18.
So. How do they know that our already registered firearm (pre-assault weapon), has in fact been made featureless if we dont register them as AW?
They don’t know that and they won’t know it unless you somehow come into contact with law enforcement with your gun.
If I am active duty military and get stationed in CA do I have to install the bullet button on my AR, or make any changes to it to make it legal in CA? Also, I am issued 30 rd mags will it be illegal for me to use these?
Your 30-rounds mags are fine on base, but you can’t take them to your private residence as I understand it. You can only possess 30-round mags in an official capacity. Again, I am not a lawyer, but that is my understanding. Yes, your private rifle must be California compliant. Unfortunately, you don’t get a pass just because the government ordered you to be here. 🙂
So basically after i register my AR as an Assault Rifle I don’t have to change anything on it if I don’t want to, I can even take the bullet button off. Does this only count for AR’s, what about any other rife with a button to release a mag like a mini 14 or a old M1 Carbine?
Well, the Mini 14 and the M1 should be featureless already and don’t require a bullet button unless you have modified them in some way. I’m assuming they do not have a flash hider. Yes, if you register your AR or make it featureless, then you can remove the bullet button and use a free state mag release.
Diablo on July 21, 2016 at 8:43 pm
Am I to understand that when you by a gun in CA a copy of the paperwork stays with DOJ. Thats seems like registration to me in that they know what you bought and your address.
Yep, that is correct. California already has “universal gun registration.” When you buy a gun in California a record is made at the DOJ and they keep those records.
If I buy a AR mag lock or Bullet Button reload will I still have to register my AR
No. The article has been updated to more clearly state this. When the article was originally written there was no AR Maglock and the Patriot Mag Release was just a video on the internet. We know a lot more about those devices now.
What about a 12 g shotgun with a detachable magazine that also has a pistol grip, collapsible stock and foregrip – or does the law only apply to center fire rifles and my Akdal 1919 shotgun is now ok?
The law will apply to shotguns too, here’s the wording in the bill.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
(b) For purposes of this section, “fixed magazine” means an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm in such a manner that the device cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.
So correct me if I’m wrong but that means we can still have all the same “evil” features on our shotguns that we were allowed to have before as long as the shotgun is not semi-automatic.
The AW laws have always been applicable to semi-automatic weapons with detachable magazines. To ban these evil features on non-magazine rifles/shotguns would run afoul of the Supreme Court in Heller, as they existed at the time 2A was ratified.
But since magazines didn’t really exist in 1788, they’re open to restriction… that’s how the courts see it today.
Given the new CA laws passed, What is your best guess on how the CA DOJ or a local DA would interpret “(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.”?
What is the legal definition of a “cylinder”? An integral part of the gun/chamber, or any part that may be attached there to?
If someone had a 12G PUMP shotgun, with a 10 round drum detachable magazine, how would that fair come 1/1/2017?
Opinions understood, not to equate to legal advice. Just need a best guess. Thanks.
Great article, I just finished building an AK47 it is unregistered if I want to register it as an AW next year how will I be able to prove that I obtained the weapon prior to the bill?
It seems to me that there are a couple of ways you could “prove” you had it prior to 1JAN2017.
1) Start the CA AW paperwork for that gun before 1JAN2017.
2) keep the receipt that you got from when you purchased the gun/80% lower. It should show the date and item(s) purchased on it.
I don’t think you can register before 2017. SB 880 says register the firearm before January 1, 2018, but not before the effective date of the regulations, isn’t the bill effective January 1, 2017?
Ya you are right. I saw the same thing after I wrote that post. Honestly IMHO I don’t think that they could even tell the difference if you had a finished 80% lower built prior to 1JAN2017 or got one after 1JAN2017 and registered it during the AW registration window unless they require you to show them a dated receipt when you try to register it.
I assume SB 880 applies to Faxon ARAK the same way as AR15’s?
Yep.
Gunfighter, I currently have 3 AR Pistols. Given the fact that they cannot be made featureless to avoid being registered as an Assault Weapon, is it logical to conclude that once registered their status basically changes?
In other words, instead of people having AR-15s or AR Pistols they all become Assault Weapons and as such it no longer matters what I put on it. My weapon goes from being a pistol in the system to being redesignated, reregistered, and I can then put any attachment and stock on it?
Definitely, definitely not. SBRs are regulated by the feds. In addition, other Cali laws don’t stop applying to your gun just because you registered it as an AW. Your’ pistols and rifles are still two VERY different things legally. Don’t conflate the two.
To avoid having to register, would installing an upper receiver with a non-reciprocating side charger work? It will no longer be a semiauto, right?
Ditto to newbToAR. I was thinking the same. I assume if you have a side or rear charge and remove the gas tube and close the gas port, it’s now considered a bolt action?? I’m also waiting on a clarification. This is the same way the UK allows its citizens to own an AR platform. Non semiauto bolt action (side or rear charge)
Well, adding a side charging upper does not in and of itself turn it into a “bolt gun”. You’d have to close off the gas system or make other changes as James suggested.
This is a great article and discussion. Thank you to the author. I was at Turners in Chino and the employees did not have the same level of knowledge or understanding of this law and consequences. Please keep us posted with updates and new information (even in an unofficial, non-attorney capacity).
Not that this is the place for the discussion, but it makes me wonder when/if the NRA or another gun-rights group will sue in an attempt to bring this to the Supreme Court (hopefully after Clinton is defeated and a 2nd amendment supporting judge is approved).
Thanks again for a great discussion!
Which of the 2 non-AW reg options is the most durable?
Which would be harder for the legislature to treat as the next loophole to be closed?
I’m afraid that’s above my pay grade. Going featureless will likely be less wear and tear on the gun.
What about the KSG shotgun? Will that be required to register as a AW?
It has a pistol grip but no remove able magazine.
No sir, AW in regards to how the new CA law is defined as a semi automatic centerfire type. KSG shotgun is not a semi automatic type but a pump shotgun :).
What’s the purpose of registering my AR, and what happens after it has been registered, Confiscation?
I can’t think of a whole lot of examples throughout history where the same tyrants who forced people to register guns did not later come by and take them.
Can a “Colt AR15” and a “HK 91” be made into legal featurless rifles and be kept in Calif ?
Yes. You just have to mask or remove the evil features.
Correct me if I’m missing something here, but if a modification (such as the bullet-button reloaded) made AR and AK-47 style firearms CA compliant, isn’t that what gun stores are going do to their existing inventory after 1/1/2017 and what they will stock going forward? And out-of-state vendors will (just like today) only ship firearms to a CA FFL which are configured as CA compliant. I see nothing saying that “evil”-featured, centerfire rifles, without a fixed magazine will no longer be sold in CA if they can be made compliant.
So, as a current owner of such a firearm with a bullet-button magazine release, I have all of 2017 to see how the law shakes out and how new AR and AK style firearms are being sold as CA compliant. Then we make the same modification to my existing firearms and nothing else changes, right? I mean if you already have a bullet-button why not replace it with a new magazine release?
I don’t see any advantages to registering as an AW other than being able to revert to a “free-state” magazine release. I’m sure some folks are hell-bent on that, but registering comes with so many negatives I can’t personally justify it. I just want to keep my firearm ownership in crappy CA as close to “business as usual” and it sounds like a small modification/inconvenience will make that possible. Am I missing something here?
Switching to “free state” is important for home defense. If I’m pinned down in my bedroom, I don’t want to have to disassemble my rifle to put another clip in.
BB Reloaded does solve this concern, but it also addresses what lawmakers wanted – to make it a royal pain to reload your AW.
Hence why I am making one of my AR-15’s an AW, and making the other a featureless rifle. Both then can rapidly reload, and all is well – except for my migraine over all this stupid red tape that accomplishes little, or worse, endangers people through accidental discharges.
Greg’s post of 8/3 in pertinent part states that he believes gun stores will be able to sell AR-15/AKs on and after 1/1/2017 with evil features under the new law so long as they have fixed magazines as newly defined. I see nothing in the new laws that comport with your reasoning that AR-15 with evil features will no longer be able to be sold here on 1/1/2017 and thereafter. What authority do you have to support your position, gunfighter tactical? In your case, being wrong may be right for you! ;-). I was surprised by your take on gun sales next year.
I’m planning on removing my pistol grip and putting on a Thordenson FRS-15 grip with buttstock. That means no more pistol grip and a fixed buttstock. Next thing is to remove my factory installed Flash Hider and put a muzzle break only device. Voila, featureless. I’m still sure I’ll get grief if I put a standard mag release on this. This is Kalifornia (sic) after all.
I also believe the new law if strictly construed requires registration as AW if it had a BB even if you change it out to what might be a 2017 compliant fixed magazine or go featureless this year. It’s the ‘you can’t unscramble an egg’ argument. Read the NEW STATUTE, PC 30900(b)(1). But the statute does not become effective until 1/1/2017, the crime of failing to register would not arise until 2018 for the failure to register in 2017. Ex post facto may arise as an issue but remember you would be charged for failing to register in 2017, not for any act you did in 2016.
A possible loophole to piss Brownie and Mr. Ghost Gun is to eliminate the “semi-automatic” capability. If the gas block is removed, it is no longer semi-automatic, therefore making it not an assault weapon and in effect, an owner can have a real magazine release with all the evil features, because each shot requires pulling the charging handle to load the next round manually, much like a bolt/lever action rifle.
Ways to keep your rifle in it’s current state + use a real magazine release button:
1. Adjustable gas key unscrewed to not cycle the next round
2. Adjustable gas block unscrewed to not cycle the next round
3. A piston unscrewed to not cycle the next round
I am curious as well. Anyone care to chime in and see if this is a good definition of the new CA law? Gunfigthertactical? Anyone that sees this avenue possible..take note that I do understand that the rifle/unit is still capable and may not be compliant. Thanks as always. 🙂
Can a “Colt AR15” and a “HK 91” named in the AW list be made into legal featurless rifles and be kept in Calif ?
Diablo- Not enough facts. Are they RAWs or not. If RAWs, one might think so. If not, unlawful to possess. I am referring solely to the older listed banned weapons. One calgunner thought there might be a way under the new law to register banned weapons now. I don’t know anything about it.
The more important point is the construction of 30900(b)1 with BB. I believe they must be registered if at any time you possessed them with BB and retain possession of them through next year, even if you have modified them to featureless or mag compliant in 2017. But if you sell featureless or mag compliant before end of 2017 you may get by without registration as AW, due to the later deadline to register of 12/31/2017.
Good info, however, I think Ryan is wrong in his section about “Can I avoid registering my gun as an “assault weapon”?”
Ryan talks about 2 options of how to avoid registering. But that is not what the SB880 requires. In short, it requires anyone who lawfully possessed an AW between 1/1/2001 and 12/31/2016 including those with the mag which can be removed with the tool (BB), register with DOJ before 1/1/2018. In other words, you can “fix” your mag as new law requires or (option 2 as advised by Ryan) to get rid of evil features, YOU’RE STILL REQUIRED TO REGISTER NO MATTER WHAT.
If you had BB before 12/31/16 you MUST register despite you’re to modify your rifle to install a “fixed mag” and removing evil features before 1/1/17. Registering is unavoidable even if you have featureless non-AW after modifications.
@Hank9, The good thing about this registration is we can get rid of the stupid bb and go to the standard mag button which will be much easier on my kids. I just need to figure out how many more stripped lowers to buy and register to last me another 40 years of builds and part innovations…
I already have a couple of RAW from 1999 and am trying to figure out if there is any impact from these new “laws” on my original RAW (other than I cannot keep the 20 and 30 round mags I have had since my time in the Army 30 years ago), vs. any new RAW “2” that I have already built for my kids to shoot.
At what point will AR platforms become C&R? I mean they were first sold in 1959 right? The design is almost 60 years old… I thought it only took 50 years to become C&R?
Why can’t you keep your 30 and 20 round 5.56/.223 mags? Convert them to 458 SOCOM by labeling your floor plates “458 SOCOM, 10 rounds”
Totally agree with entirety of Hank9’s post of August 11, 2016. Modifications will NOT excuse duty to register.
Check the statutes for yourself, especially amended PC 30900(b)(1), New PC 30680, and PC 30605.
On another matter, just wanted to amend a prior statement I made here. Failure to register is apparently not a crime in itself but you could be felony-arrested and charged with a violation of PC 30605 in 2018 if you have not registered.
Hank, I disagree with your comment about mandatory registration because you started with a BB. In reading through AB-1135 in the provided link, that would only be true if you did not complete the featureless build by end of 2016. If you did complete the featureless build by the end on 2016, then you never had a AW in my opinon.
Also regarding stocks, from what I have read, permanent and pinned is used specifically related to magazines. That word is never used regarding stocks. So if you had an adjustable stock, and then fixed it with a screw. The stock is no longer telescoping and meets the intent on the law. Knothing that I have found on line from the DOJ, mentions that a stock has to be permanently secured and pinned in CA to be compliant. If some one finds other information from the DOJ, please include a link.
will either ab 1135 or sb 880 effect my M1A (M14), I have already replaced the flash suppressor with a compensater, the 20 round mags not withstanding?
Im moving to California. If I put a bullet button reloaded on my Vepr 12 (AK shotgun) that has lots of evil features in theory do I not have to register it? Thanks
I know that when it comes to this so called ban on assault weapons the lowers receiver on most rifles that can be taken apart such as the AR15 is considered the actual gun because it contains the bullet button and so on?? Will I still be allowed to purchase completed upper receivers for an AR type weapon after Jan 1,2017?
Does any of this apply to a Kel-tech KSG?
No, because the KSG does not have a detachable magazine and is NOT a semiautomatic.
Just curious: if we register it as an assault weapon, would that allow us to make modifications that only assault weapons are allowed to have? Other than a bullet button removal that is. If the rifle is now in the same classification as an M16(full auto version example), then can we legally convert it into a fully automatic weapon because it no longer falls into the category of a si automatic rifle nut is now an assault rifle anyhow?
Full auto falls under the NFA and requires a tax stamp but under CA law it is a felony to own a full auto firearm. Also I am not sure of the exact year listed but any full auto rifles manufactured after that year are illegal for individuals to own regardless if your state allows it.
What is the website where i can register my bullet button ar15 as an assault rifle for $20. Everything i find says the cal doj is no longer accepting assault weapon registration.
Mark, that refers to prior registrations.
You will not be able to register your weapon until some time in 2017. Also, the online registration will not be possible until AFTER the DOJ adopts implementing REGULATIONS concerning the new statutes.
Sorry, there is a lot to read through…I was just wondering if it okay to keep the AR pistol without going featureless but basically make it a 22lr ar pistol? Does that action devoid me of both registration, etc.? If so, then I’m going shopping and selling my center fire pistol uppers and using the money to buy a 22lr pistol upper.
Attention Gun Owners, vote to remove the Democraps majority in Sacramento and watch how fast things change, Brown, Deleon and Newsom only want gun control when they have a super majority. Once the gold egg is removed, gun safety is unimportant. They only want the power!!!!
Ryan, can I still purchase a complete (CA compliant w/ bullet button) AR-15 lower receiver as of today (9/11/16)?
I’ve recently ordered a complete lower receiver w/ bullet button from palmettostatearmory.com and had it shipped to ffl dealer in CA (LC Action).
I got a voicemail message from LC Action saying that my they have “the complete lower receiver” at the store for me. Of course I called back and advised I would be there over the weekend to pick it up and they did not express any concerns regarding the complete lower receiver.
So on 9/10/16, I get there and LC action refused to sell me the receiver because it is “not a complete rifle” without the upper. They told me I would have to bring in an upper receiver to properly register the lower receiver.
This does not make sense to me because I when I asked them what if I ordered a stripped receiver, they told me it would have been ok for me to purchase just the stripped lower.
The employee then showed me the CA DOJ form which had a box for “barrell length” and said it had to be filled out.
From my understanding, there are three options to register the lower receiver (or any firearm):
1) handgun/pistol;
2) long rifle; or
3) other
I thought I could register it as “other.”
I had the idea that if I wanted to complete my build as an ar-pistol, I would change the buttstock (to ie stabilizer) to legally have a 8.5″, 10.5″, or whatever barrell length I desired.
Meanwhile, I do have a 16″ upper receiver to complete the build.
I’ve googled and searched for the legality of purchasing a (CA compliant) complete lower receiver but could not find an answer.
Can anyone help please or provide links to laws pertaining to purchasing complete lower receivers in CA please.
I want to know whether or not CA DOJ permits the sales of a complete lower receiver (w/ bullet button). If possible, please provide links.
Thanks in advance.
I think it depends on the shop. Some shops require you to complete additional information such as long-gun safe make and model or they will refuse to sell you the rifle. I bought and picked up a stripped lower last week, but the shop that requires the firearm safe information never asked for the barrel information.
David Dave – your FFL is an idiot. There’s no CA requirement for you to have an upper in order to purchase the completed lower. Even a stripped AR lower is considered a rifle so how would they process that transaction?
I have 3 complete registered pistol lowers for sale in Sacramento and they’re listed on three different sites. I specifically point out that I’ll ONLY use Rocklin Armory for the PPT because (a) they know their stuff and (b) Just Guns in Sacramento kept adding requirements in order to do the PPT and a guy who was going to buy all of them got tired of their crap & backed out, costing me a lot of time & money. After Dec 21st, 2016 you won’t be able to buy registered pistol lowers anymore via PPT because they’ll be considered AWs. Q & A on DOJ site says if the background check / 10-day waiting period is started on or before 12-21-16 but is delayed past 12-31-16 the FFL won’t be allowed to give you the firearm so the buyer would be out the $$$.
Hey Ryan,
I have a couple of questions:
Scenario 1 – My plan is to get a crack-action magazine lock (Patriot Mag Release or AR Mag Lock) for my current AR-15 to avoid registration. At the same time, purchasing a second AR-15 lower before 2017 with a bullet button, collapsible stock, and pistol grip, which will be registered as an “Assault Weapon” and use a free-state mag release after 2017. Both lower setups will be CA-compliant. However, I am not planning to get an upper for this AW lower, and just going to swap my 5.56mm upper from the other lower with the crack-action mag lock. So “IF” the state decides to confiscate my rifle, can I just give them the registered lower since the upper was never bought for this gun? (Or tell them, “Sorry, I have already sold the upper and this is all there’s left.”)
Scenario 2 – Upon registration for the AW, I believe there is a required field to fill in the caliber of the rifle. Would you recommend putting in “Multi-Cal”, “5.56mm NATO”, or “.223 Remington”? I suppose if they can only confiscate the upper with the registered caliber. (Perhaps one can register it as .300 Blackout and tell them, “I never got to finish building the upper in that caliber”, which is true).
No thoughts? Bump.
Ken:
The lower receiver is the only part of the AR Platform type rifle that is considered to be a firearm. Not the upper receiver or the parts inside the lower receiver(lower parts kit)If you ever have to turn it in do to a ban and confiscation on AR platform rifles you should give them only a completely stripped lower receiver and nothing else.
Ken – The CA DOJ no longer accepts “Multi” as a caliber when doing a registration, at least via the IntraFamilial Transfer process on a couple of pistol lowers. They used to accept it but returned my son’s paperwork with a request to specify a caliber. It’s my understanding that you can change uppers/calibers as long as you can change it back to it’s original registered caliber. It’s legal – Federally – to go Pistol>Rifle>Pistol but not the other way around. That’s why I always have the lowers engraved “Pistol” before they’re registered.
I am planning on moving to Cali can I register my assault weapon before I bring it into the state? If I do this before January 1 2017
Currently, CA DOJ does not have a formal registration process for the new law. The representative on the phone told me this process be most likely available after January 1, 2017. I would just call the CA DOJ Assault Weapon department at (916) 227-2153 and find out directly from them.
Does anyone know the website for registering the ARs??
As stated right above your post, the registration process most likely won’t be available until after January 1, 2017. Please check back on the California DOJ Assault Weapon department at https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/regagunfaqs after.
I have an ARES SCR with a Monte Carlo stock (differing from the traditional AR15 style). It is a semi-automatic centerfire rifle with a detachable magazine, but has none of the “evil features.”
Any idea if the rifle will continue to remain CA compliant and not listed as an AW? Thanks.
You rifle is featureless and will still remain to be a California compliant rifle. There is no need for you to resister as an AW.
Wait… if my current AR has a bullet button now, and I register it; and it becomes an “Assault Weapon,” why CAN I use a normal Free-State mag release?
I understand that California will be banning Hi-Capacity magazines. But, California classifies assault weapon as something with a detachable magazine, evil features and high-cap rounds.
What makes it okay to have a Free-State mag release?
I believe the logic is that in 2017, the state doesn’t see any difference between a regular mag release and the original BB. In 2016 CA law was that if a tool was needed for the mag release then it’s not an AW. If you built a black rifle in 2016 with a BB it wasn’t an AW. If you built a featureless rifle in 2016 and it had a BB, it wasn’t an AW.
If you take the BB off of a black rifle in 2016 and make it featureless, it’s not an AW. Why you would then choose to register a featureless rifle in 2017 as an AW makes no sense me when under the law it was never an AW to begin with. Further, a featureless rifle in 2017 is still not an AW.
The key here is the “Removable Magazine”. The Bullet Button is recognized as a “Fixed Magazine” for now until January 1st 2017. The new laws redefine BB as a “Removable Magazine”, which is classified on the same level as a Free-State mag release.
Please keep in mind that you HAVE TO keep the BB on the lower receiver until the Assault Weapon registration process is completed.
I am curious. A friend and I were talking about this earlier today. He has a Bushmaster XM15 he bought off a friend back in 2006 so he couldn’t register it if he had wanted to. It was bought legally in CA pre-ban of the XM15. Would he be able to register this gun and own it legally in CA with this law or are the ones already on the list perma-banned regardless of this law?
If it is specifically listed in the original Roberti Roos list and is not currently registered to you under the old assault weapons law you cannot register it under the new law. And the XM-15 IS on the original list.
Thanks for the info James.
I am active duty military and CA is my state of residents. I’m currently stationed in NC, while hear I purchased an AR-15. I have orders to go back to CA. DO I need to make this CA compliant before I can register it with the DOJ?
Read through a bunch of stuff, but either I passed it, or getting old and forgot, but here goes
1)If someone buys an 80% gets a serial number and then jacks up the build…. does that person need a NEW number for a second try or could they use the previous number till they get an 80% properly milled?
2) If you buy an 80% apply for a number, are these numbers treated like a DROS and run a back ground check prior to number being issued?
3) If you buy an 80% whether you make if featureless, or use the new bullet button where you have to crack the action open – you still need a serial number?
4) any 80% builds getting grandfathered in?
thanks for taking time to answer.
If your building a rifle next year and buy a 80% block of Al. The process would be build the rifle, then apply for a serial number within I think 10 days. The same DROS stuff would be required by the state as if you bought a regular fully machined lower. If you are eligible to own the rifle the state will send you a serial number. You don’t get the serial number and then start the build.
In California, and I am not sure of the effective date, but every rifle will need a serial number, home built or featureless, it doesn’t matter. The ATF does not have that requirement for home built rifles at the federal level.
The grandfather part is if you build the 80% rifle this year, you have until July 2017 to assign your own serial number legally. It can be engraved on the receiver to manufacturer’s standards or permanently attached.
Then you have a legal featureless rifle with a serial number and it does not at this time need to be registered with the state. The ATF has no such requirement for home built rifles so your good with them as well. If you didn’t want to go featureless, and used the new ar mag lock or updated BB to avoid the AW label, the same rules apply. You just can’t legally build an 80% AW rifle this year with out a BB, and not at all next year.
Please call 80% at (949)-354-2767 or email them at sales@80percentarms.com. I would rather seek answers from them directly than shooting in the dark on forums.
Gunfighter, as others have said, thank you for taking the time to help others attempt to interpret these insane new laws on AR15’s however, I have another question that may have already been answered and I did try to read all comments. If I install the ARmaglock which I have already purchased, as you see it, does this mean I can still have my forward vertical grip, pistol grip, flash suppressor, telescopic stock, and my railed forearm? I see where most of this was answered previously but the vertical grip and railed forearm was a question for me. Thanks again!
Yes.
WarriorIII:
To be safe, no forward vertical grip (by-pod OK) Definitely no flash suppressor. Muzzle brakes only, restrictions on flash hiders and suppressors have been in place for years now, They fall under a separate restrictive law and are illegal in California.
Wrong…. broke said he has a the ArMaglock installed rendering the rifle now as having a fixed mag. If so, you can have all the evil features you want.
Thanks for the great information.
I have a question regarding what constitutes an AW that needs to be registered. If you start with a stripped lower you could build it into either a featureless rifle or an assault rifle that legally requires registration. What if you own a stripped lower and separately have the parts to build a completed assault rifle, but never complete the build. Is this incomplete build considered an assault rifle?
My understanding is an assault rifle is only created after attaching a evil feature to the lower, but if you never attach them then no assault rifle exists. Is this correct?
I would think that depends on if all the evil parts are in the same gun safe with the receiver. It’s just my opinion, but from what I have read, you have to be careful what is kept together when the parts are disassembled.
Scroll up and read Molon Labe’s comment on “Constructive Possession”. The short answer is “Yes” – If you have only a stripped lower and all the parts needed to construct an assault rifle (with a free-state magazine release), then you’re guilty under Constructive Possession.
You are correct. A stripped lower is the only part of the rifle that is considered to be a firearm. A stripped lower receiver has no features attached to it weather they are evil ones or not, There for it is not an assault weapon, yet, and is will not be illegal to posses.
One noob here, a fresh CA exile from Alaska by marriage.
My thought is, I just had possession of a Colt LE6920 from Turner’s after DROS, etc the whole she-bang paperwork. Now, can I still purchase AR uppers maybe like a 458 Socom complete upper after 01012017?
I would greatly appreciate any insight.
An upper receiver is not a firearm. The lower receiver is the only part of the AR Platform type rifle that is considered to be a firearm. You will be able to purchase parts such as upper receivers. But you know the leftists will catch on to this eventually and it is a certainty that they will attempt through legislation to put a stop to purchasing all AR rifle parts some time in the near future.
I am moving to California from Alask. I own a Ruger AR 15.
Is it legal for me to move there with it as of right now??
Ryan, I just wanted to correct you on your comment about not being able to by stripped lowers. I am a CA gun dealer and have spoke with my DOJ reb multiple times about the purchase of stripped lowers. You will still be able to buy them after the first of the year. Don’t worry.
Question. If we register our aks as assault weapons, can we then have a folding stock, underfolder etc… with a 16 inch barrel?
A registered assault rifle can have evil features such as a telescoping or folding stock. This applies across all military-styled rifles such as an AR-15 or AK-47.
Barrel length would need to be least 16″. If you have a barrel that’s shorter than 16″, you have the option to permanently pinned a muzzle brake or a flash hider that makes the total length 16+”.
16″ unless its registered as a pistol.once registered, as i said in another post you can have all the evil features you want
I understand ar pistols are classified as AW. However, the article mentioned using a bullet button to avoid registering. Now if I go this route using a bb, can I still be able to sell it or pass it down to my children?
No, the law prohibits any sale or inheritance of AWs.
Quoted from the article – SB 880/ AB 1135 define an assault pistol as having “A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.“
your wrong ken. even with pistols, if you have the break action price setup you DONT need to register a ar pistol as an assault weapon.
Bushman, you seem to have more information on the AR Pistols. Thanks for your clarifications.
If i don’t register the AR-15 I bought in 2016 as an “assault rifle” and install a mag lock device on it, can I pass it to my son when I die without him needing to strip off all of the features?
That is correct under the current new law. As long as California DOJ does not pass more laws that voids this loophole.
Questioning the comment regarding lending of AW’s, AB1511 would still allow lending between the parties listed, so for example my Dad can still lend me his registered AR legally (and vise versa) as long as it’s done so as prescribed in AB1511.
I didn’t read anything in AB1135 or SB880 that would prohibit this from taking place. So in theory, you could do a family transfer prior to 1/1/17 to an eligible party (child, grandchild, spouse, etc) and lend to members listed in AB1511 if you are concerned about losing your AW when you die. Just a way of I can think of to legally keep what is yours in your family. Or just go featureless or convert to a fixed mag and be done with it.
It seems like to me that the most important consideration here should be, “How do you intend to use the rifle?” If you plan to keep the rifle in your safe and/or completely out of public knowledge and view, and use the rifle only as a self defense weapon when things go bad, then it seems like a fair consideration to NOT register it and just stay below the radar or make it featureless which is awkward to use but easy to reverse.
If, on the other hand, you plan to shoot organized competition with it like NRA Service Rifle or 3-gun, or use it for hunting or even just to take it to public ranges for target shooting, it seems like a better choice to register it with DOJ. It’s only $20 and the law is so full of built-in loop holes that any time you want to, or if it seems confiscation is imminent, you can easily de-register it and make it featureless or remove it from the state.
I for one, want to be free to use my AR’s for public view type uses like competition and featureless rifles just don’t work well for that. I don’t want to risk a felony conviction that, even with a suspended sentence or probation, might result in a court ordered permanent restriction from me owning ANY firearm. I don’t consider that to be “giving in”, I just consider it “playing the game”.
Well said. If you can’t learn to adapt, then you risk losing all you have.
Ex post facto laws are unconstitutional. Article 9 and article 10 state that no states shall pass an ex post facto law.
The Cornell Legal Information Institute defines Ex Post Facto as:
Latin for ‘from a thing done afterward.’ Ex post facto is most typically used to refer to a criminal law that applies retroactively, thereby criminalizing conduct that was legal when originally performed. Two clauses in the US Constitution prohibit ex post facto laws: Art 1, § 9 and Art. 1 § 10. see, e.g. Collins v. Youngblood, 497 US 37 (1990) and California Dep’t of Corrections v. Morales, 514 US 499 (1995).
So seriously did the Founders take this issue that ex post facto laws are twice explicitly prohibited in the Constitution, first in Article I, Section 9, Clause 3:
No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.
And in Article I, Section 10, Clause 1:
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
Not sure your “AR pistols cannot have a second handgrip” statement means you cannot have a handguard. I’m pretty sure it means you cannot have a vertical foregrip or something similar.
once registered as an assault weapon, your pistol can have all the evil features youd like. if you decided to use a drop in 22lr conversion kit in lew of registration, you can have all the evil features your heart desires, INCLUDING a forward hand grip.if your AR pistol has a bullet button in california (and is longer than 26″ per federal guidelines)you can have a forward grip NOW.
George Stephenson
A CA registered AR pistol can use an angled forward grip but not a vertical grip. Using a vertical grip on a pistol instantly makes it a SBR. But – if you put an upper on it with a barrel that’s over 16″ you can add a buttstock & vertical grip. As long as it’s over 26″ long it’s a rifle. Remove those items, reinstall the short upper & you’re back to a pistol. I live in America but my son lives in Califorcommie and he has two registered pistol lowers. One was originally manufactured as a pistol & the other was a stripped lower that was registered as a pistol. He has one as a pistol & built a rifle from the stripped lower but legally he could change it to a pistol by removing the buttstock, etc.
By installing the new style break open BB he won’t have to register either of them as AWs.
So if someone is a gun collector, and has Rifles that is worth 4-7K Each and has purchased these guns because he knows some day his children and his children’s kids will inherit these…. he is going to loose it all! is that person screwed ?????
I was under the impression that all Assault Weapons (those without bullet buttons) had to have been registered with the state several years ago (2001?) and that those guns after that date (with bullet buttons) could not be converted legally to have standard mag releases unless they were made featureless.
In other words, just because you now have to register your AR-15 with a bullet button & features, that does not mean you can now change over to a standard mag release…unless it was registered as such prior to the 2001(?) date.
per “derrick” at california DOJ, yes you can. nothing in the law states you have t keep your rifle after registered as a bullet button. theres not going to be any provision in the registration asking if it was or is bullet button or not. i didnt ask him, but under the new law ( since their all considered assault weapons now regardless of mag release if they have evil features)one would assume you could put a FSMR on your AR now, like i said, just assuming.
The Bullet Button is recognized as a “Fixed Magazine” for now until January 1st 2017. The new laws redefine the Bullet Button as a “Removable Magazine” – an assault feature, which is classified on the same level as a Free-State (standard) mag release.
In other words, having either a Bullet Button or a standard mag release makes no difference in the eyes of the California DOJ starting 2017.
Are uzis considered a pistol that would not apply to the AW registration since they don’t have a floating “shroud”
These new laws are in regards to center fire rifles. Specifically AR’s, AK’s and such. As far as I know an Uzi is not a center fire rifle.
I am confused as to whether or not a spouse can shoot an AW, if the owner of the AW is with him or her. Near the beginning of this thread, Gunfighter talked about how you will not be able to lend your wife your soon-to-be AW to shoot, that the owner of the AW has to be with it at all times, and could not be 300 yards away on a hunt. I took this to mean there can be no significant independent possession of the gun by the non-owner (i.e., a spouse could not borrow her husband’s AW and go shooting with friends), but thought we could shoot it together at the range when we are side by side. My FFL told me today no, a spouse cannot even touch it, no one can touch it other than the registered AW owner.
I have had an AR a couple years, purchased legally with all the registration paperwork in CA. My husband and I go to the range and should it together. We lie the features it has for ergonomic reasons, and have no interest in going featureless. The FFL said even if I reregister it as an AW, he will no longer be able to share my AR with me at the range.
Is that correct? If yes, then the only solution, as he wants to shoot an AR, (other than jumping through the ‘make it featureless’ hurdles etc.) appears to be to have him get his own AW, so we have his and hers. And I guess he will no longer even be able to courtesy-carry my case back into the house when we unload the car after going to the range.
As a result of the new law, we will now have to become a 2 AW household, instead of a one AW household, if we want to keep any AR-15 for both the range and as a backup for SHTF days. Bizarre, given the intent of the law is less guns, not more.
If what your FFL said was true, then let me suggest you another loophole. The laws define only the lower on your AR the actual “gun”, which means the upper by itself is considered as “parts” even if the lower is registered as an assault weapon.
That being said – Your husband can just get another AR LOWER before 2017, register it as an assault weapon, and share the same upper you have. That way, you will become a 1.5-AW household, instead of a two-AW household.
Of course, you can always avoid registration and the hassle of having more than 1 AR by converting your mag release from the Bullet Button to the “AR Mag Lock” (recommended) or the “Patriot Mag Release”.
First, most of the “felonies” stated are actually misdemeanors. Secondly, what happened to the whole “they can try to take my guns” people. Me personally, CA crossed the line and is no longer following the constitution. I don’t care if a liberal court says they are. People need to stand up and protest, rebel the unjust law. If a law is unjust it is your duty to not obey. The supposed bad ass freedom lovers will march to the grave if the law said to. A stick by itself is easily broken but a bundle of sticks tied together is strong. If a few brake this law then they are criminals but if we all broke it it becomes a movement or protest. But I have yet to find a single person who truly believes in what they preached. I’m libertarian as a way of life. I’m a republican voter. So above all and just under God is my belief in liberty and the right to protect life and property from citizens or government. We are born free and we die free but wether or not you live free is up to you.
Great philosophical passions! Although in the principal of democracy, the majority of the California citizens favor the new laws as a result of “a bundle of sticks tied together” in the opposite of your interest. As the minority, we still pertain the rights to own firearms in this state as protected by our Second Amendment.
Fortunately, there are many other states where the majority rules in favor of firearm ownership without restrictions if you feel strongly against this movement.
I’m with you brotha ,we need ban together they can’t stop us all . MOLON LABE!
I must be missing something so I’ll ask.. If one does register an AR15 in California, does that mean the firearm can stay as is with Pistol grip, Forward pistol grip, Adjustable stock
Flash suppressor?
Yes.
Explained to me why this is happening. There were 12,694,243 votes cast in Calif. in 2012. There are an estimated 8,220,412 gun owner in Calif. Do the math, there should not be even one gun control advocate in our state government. Add in friends and family and taking back our state should happen easily. Get out and vote against the gun grabbers! If you don’t vote or you are voting for these gun control traitors you can’t cry about losing your rights.
what If I am not ready to purchase the gun as a whole right now? Am I able to just buy the lower receiver now and buy the upper along with the hardware kit later or will the upper be classified as an “assault weapon” after Jan 1st 2017?
Luigi Race
You can buy a stripped lower in CA but it’ll always be registered as a rifle when you buy it. In my state it’s listed as “Other” on the ATF Form 4473 but when the dealer does a BGC with our State Police it’s always listed as a pistol.
You can build it as you have the time & $$$ and if you use the latest version of the ‘break open’ bullet button it won’t have to be registered as an AW even if you put the scary parts on it. Just make sure your barrel is a minimum of 16″ and the overall length is a minimum of 26″ and you’ll be legal.
let just say that no one complies to these new so called ”assault weapon” laws and not register there ar15 with all the evil features are they going to arrest all of the millions of law bidding citizens that own ar15? we need to ban together and fight for whats right. CA is run by a tyrannical government.
when I went to the range a little more than a month ago. There was this guy gathering as much signatures as possible appeal the recent gun measures. We needed 300k signatures but only got 100k. This is for the entire California. What happened? He told me even though there are many gun owners in the state, ppl just don’t care. I signed btw, but it wasn’t enough. Someone should go to change.org and start a movement. not me though, I’m too ashamed of us all to get just 100k signatures when there are millions of gun owners in cali. Sigghhhh…….
Just to clarify, if I move into CA I can bring my AR as long as I use the Bullet Button Reloaded mag lock OR make it featureless?
You will have to move to California and register your rifle in California before Jan 1, 2017 After Jan 1,2017 it will be considered an assault weapon and bringing an assault weapon into California will be a felony.
Regarding this requirement:When you die, your “assault weapon” essentially dies with you. When you die, your guns will generally be handed down by bequest or by succession, usually to your spouse or children. Your spouse or child (or whoever) has no more than 90 days to send the guns out of state, render them permanently inoperable, or to turn them over to law enforcement for destruction. If your spouse or child has possession of the guns 90 days after your death, they have committed a felony punishable by no more than 1 year in county jail and substantial fines.
Since the lower receiver is the only part of the rifle that is considered to be a firearm. After I die,can my children remove the upper from the lower,strip the lower of all it parts and turn in the stripped lower alone? Can they then sell those parts or build a featureless rifle with those parts?
My husband has an AR and he bought it legally from a private party through an FFL. We live in California, but are purchasing a second home in Texas. Is it legal to simply store the gun in Texas without notification to anyone in California?
Thanks!
I don’t beleave that you would have to tell Ca. that you are storing them in Texas. But you do have to tell Texas. But if you do that it will be a felony for you ever to bring them back into Ca. But who would know right. If you do bring them back make sure they are Ca. complaint with an AR-Maglok or Patriot Mag Release that is being marketed by Bullet Button.
I have three registered stripped AR15 lowers that I have not built up. I was planning on registering them as AWs next year. Is it important that they be built this year, or just that I owned them this year? How the heck is the state going to know how and when I completed them? Seems like I just register my stripped lowers as AW before 2018 and I can do whatever I want. Right?
You can Register them as AW’s without build a complete rifle. But why would you want to register as an assault weapon.
Also a stripped lower is not an assault weapon. A stripped lower receiver has no evil features attached to it that would make it necessary to classify it as an assault weapon. So why on earth would you want to register something that is not an assault weapon as an assault weapon?
Wavecraft, think beyond your bubble. I believe what Greg wants here is the option to having all the “evil features” along with a free-state standard mag-release. The only way to enable this setup is to have a registered AW which the stripped lower was purchased prior to 2017.
Who will enforce this law? Local law enforcement or ATF?
Any law enforcement personnel that finds you with it in your possession.
I’m gonna save Gunfighter the effort of replying to my question above since I see he answered the question already. Since I already own the lowers and they are registered, all I need to do is register them as AW before the end of 2017. To add a further comment, it seems like the state is never going to know when I actually build them up. It could be 2019 for all they know, but as long as that serial number is in my name before the end of 2016 and registered as an AW before the end of 2017, I’m good to go.
Why would you want to register them as an assault weapon? All you have to do is install the AR-Maglok. Do really want the DOJ to know your name, phone#, street address, Email address,how many firearms you own. Just so they can have your info. in the data base and they will know who and were to confiscate your firearms if in the future they meet the liberal goal of a total ban on AR rifles. Not to mention there ultimate goal of a total and complete firearms ban altogether. Screw that, not me.
Let’s be very clear here. The DOJ already has a list of registered AR and AK gun owners they have been collecting for years. Now all they have to do is cross-reference all those who register these guns as “Assault Weapons”. Those who do not register for AW status are not necessary felons as they may have converted their guns to featureless already. Bottom line the DOJ can enforce this law, however to what extent will they?
Wavecraft – Under the new laws, you can have two types lowers that would be able to accept uppers all the “evil features” in California. One with the AR Mag-Lock which enables the crack-action magazine release (but would take two additional steps such as having to release your bolt before opening the action and recharge it after). Another one is a lower that’s a registered AW purchased prior to 2017 (but does not require to be a complete build), with a free-state standard magazine release.
If you don’t wish to go featureless in California, then you can have two lowers setup as mentioned above to share the same upper with all the “evil features”. When it really comes down to turning in the rifle to the DOJ, you turn in only the lower that’s the registered AW and say the upper build was never finished. That way, you can keep the upper with other lower that has the AR Mag-Lock.
Also a stripped lower is not an assault weapon. A stripped lower receiver has no evil features attached to it that would make it necessary to classify it as an assault weapon. So why on earth would you want to register something that is not an assault weapon as an assault weapon?
Wavecraft, think beyond your bubble. I believe what Greg wants here is the option to having all the “evil features” along with a free-state standard mag-release. The only way to enable this setup is to have a registered AW which the stripped lower was purchased prior to 2017.
I think the idea of register it now because you want a pistol grip and switch them to featureless later so you can pass on to your son is rolling the dice. Once the state has you on the AR15 AW roster, are they going to still require inspections for your featureless rife to make sure it complies to current CA law, which will most likely continue to change.
The list makes it very easy to enforce future laws that apply retroactively. Rather than punishing people who commit actual crimes with fire arms, they will have the ability to go after other wise law abiding citizens for simple owning a gun that was purchased legally in the past.
It’s not about preventing homicides, it’s about restricting gun ownership. Because everyone knows if you eliminate civilian gun ownership, people will stop all other forms of violence. They will immediately put down their rocks, stand in a circle and sing happy songs.
I am Installing AR Maglok’s on my rifles. This will make my Rifle Ca. compliant. Therefor it will not be a rifle that is classified as an assault weapon and it will be legal for me to sell it or give it to my children or bequest it.
Here is my dumb question: Aren’t all firearms purchased from FFL registered with the state anyways? What is the difference with registering it as an AW? (yes, I understand there is a sentiment that any registration is a violation of the constitution, I am just wondering what differences you have to live with once registered)
The way I understand it is that when you legally purchase a firearm from an FFL. All the information of what it is you purchased, date of purchase the serial number and such is recorded on the dealers record of sale (DROS) not in a DOJ Data base. Maybe I’m wrong. I will ask next time I go to my favorite gun shop.
Also if they are already registered with the state in a data base of some sort. They haven’t been classified as an assault weapon until now and registered as assault weapon until now. So I guess that is the big difference. They just want to have a separate and simplified data base to turn to, in the future to I.D. the people that own these rifles. So in the future if they achieve there goal of an all out ban on AR & AK type rifles, not to mention there ultimate goal of banning the ownership of all guns in California, is they will have a great idea who to send out the notification letters, stating that you have to turn in your firearms. Once you register it as an AW your screwed. You can never sell, give, lend, or trade an assault weapon to another person. Nor can you hand down an “assault weapon” to your spouse, children, or grandchildren. If you move out of the state, you cannot move back into the state with your guns once they have been registered as an assault weapon. Don’t do It. Just make your rifle compliant, by adding an AR MagLok. No good for competition shooting but I’m still going to have a good time at the range. This way you can keep the rifle with all the so called evil features. If some kind of civil unrest were to occur, that we would actually need to use our rifles in a domestic defensive combat situation, it will take me all but about 3or4 minutes to remove the MagLok and install a factory original mag release button.
I believe it’s good to have a second lower as a registered AW as an option. Since there are no laws defining if the lower needs to be built completely, it can share the same upper as the other lower that has the AR Mag-Lock / Patriot Mag-Release.
Being able to posses an AR-15 in California with a free-state regular magazine release legally is a limited-time privilege, and this can only be done through registering a pre-2017 lower by 2018.
If you buy a lower after Jan 1,2017,
Can you still reg it as an assault weapon??
Based on the new laws in CA, you won’t be able to legally build a new AW in 2017, only register one that was built in 2106 with a bullet button. You will still be able to purchase lowers in 2017, but would be required to either used a Mag Lock or build a featureless rife.
My local Gun shop says the R1 will be on the list that needs to be registered. I am on the fence about buying one if that is the case, on one hand, I want to buy one if I will never have the chance to buy one again, on the other hand, I don’t really want to own/register an “assault rifle” for a variety of reasons. Does anyone know definitively the answer? I read the law and it seems like its a bit of a grey area. My local place just says “it could accept a 10 round mag, so therefore it is.” They also believe the Browning BAR will need to be registered as well.
Could I give the gun to a friend in Kansas through a licensed Dealer?
Joe –
You can ship the gun to your friend in Kansas via two methods;
1 – If he has a FFL who’ll accept firearms from a private party (tell him to find one who does) you can send a color copy of your ID to the FFL & then ship them the gun via USPS. Scroll down to 432.3 for details. http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c4_009.htm
2 – Have a FFL ship it for you but expect them to charge a fortune.
I have a rifle that was purchased before 2014 when they required a rifle registration. What do you suggest that I do? To register it as an assault rifle means that they know I have this gun, but to not do it would mean that it’d be a ghost gun and that I’d possible be breaking the law for having it?
Please advise. Thank you!
I think the mag lock is a good solution and in the future if things change, you can turn it back in 5 minutes
https://www.armaglock.com/laws/
I agree. The “AR Mag-Lock” is better designed and easier to install compared to the more popular “Bullet Button Reloaded / Patriot Mag-Release”. It’s also easily reversible unlike the latter which is a permanent-install.
If you don’t care about having the ambidextrous capability on the magazine release with your left hand, then the AR Mag-Lock is the clear winner.
If I were to put the bullet button reloaded on an AR pistol, can I avoid using the annoying pistol “stock” and use a collapsible stock?
Jack –
NO!! If you put a collapsible stock on a pistol lower with a barrel less than 16″ long you’ve just created a Class 3 Short Barreled Rifle and they’re illegal to own in CA. I don’t live in your state but filed for my ATF stamp & it took six months for approval. In OR we can have anything we want as long as we pay the fees.
Under the new California laws, you can have two types of lowers that would be able to accept uppers all the “evil features” in the state. One with the “AR Mag-Lock / Patriot Mag-Release” which enables crack-action magazine release, but takes two additional steps to reload (having to release your bolt before opening the action and recharge the bolt after). Another one is a registered AW lower purchased prior to 2017, and can be later converted to accept a free-state standard magazine release.
If you don’t wish to go featureless in California, then a smart option is to get two lowers setup as mentioned above to share the same upper with all the “evil features”. When it really comes down to turning in the rifle to the DOJ, you simply turn in only the lower that’s the registered AW and tell them the upper build was never finished. That way, you can keep the upper with the other lower that has the AR Mag-Lock / Patriot Mag-Release.
As far as choosing between the AR Mag-Lock and the Patriot Mag-Release, if you don’t care about having the ambidextrous capability on the magazine release with your left hand, then the AR Mag-Lock is the clear winner with better design and easier installation process.
I believe it’s good to have a second lower as a registered AW as an option. Since there are no laws defining if the lower needs to be built completely, it can share the same upper as the other lower that has the AR Mag-Lock / Patriot Mag-Release.
Being able to posses an AR-15 in California with a free-state regular magazine release legally is a limited-time privilege, and this can only be done through registering a pre-2017 lower by 2018.
So , let me see if I understand this law correctly. If I ordered an AR LOWER , like a LMT lower, with all the evil features , like a standard mag release .I would have to have it in my possession before Jan 1, 2017 and have to have it registered before Jan 1, 2018 as an AW ?
Tony, you are almost correct. Although you can register your AR-15 as an assault weapon with all the evil features EXCEPT a standard mag release. If you try to register one with a standard mag release, it would be felony with 10 years of imprisonment. The idea is to register it with a Bullet Button first, and then swap it out for a standard mag release after the registration is completed.
IMPORTANT UPDATE:
As of 12/30/2016, a new set of gun laws by California DOJ patched this loophole as indicated below. So any information stated in my initial comment should be scrapped.
• The release mechanism for an ammunition feeding device on an assault weapon registered pursuant to Penal Code section 30900, subdivision (b)(1) shall not be changed after the assault weapon is registered.
• The Department will not register a firearm as an assault weapon unless the firearm is fully assembled and fully functional.
So, a Ruger Mini-14, with a bullet button but none of the other evil features is now an assault weapon that has to be registered? Or not? And a Bushmaster registered many years ago before the first CA assault weapon ban, is still legal because it was registered and doesn’t have to be re-registered or modified?
There are now over 400 comments here and the vast majority concern only compliance-related questions or interpretations of the new “law”.
In 21st-century America, this is how adult, law-abiding citizen taxpayers in a free country react when mommy-dearest government oversteps her bounds (i.e., “My gosh, how will we ever comply, but we must and we will!”). In the case of California, this is obviously true because the state no longer has an “undocumented worker” problem, no more “justice-challenged” urban areas, and even no more high taxes nor local governmental shenanigans. Most importantly, on 01 JAN 2017, the Eureka state will be essentially rendered safe from “gun violence”…
So take a lesson all people of America: The government will thoughtfully and energetically do everything to keep you safe! Just be sure to follow every new firearms restriction imposed (just as all of our dazzling barrio and inner-city inhabitants most certainly will too). But after day one of the new year, in the state of California, if you do happen to become a victim of murder, rape, robbery, and/or any other assault, I encourage you (or your heirs) to sue the living **** out of your state “leadership” for breach of implied contract. Happy New Year!
Thank god we elected Donald Trump to the Presidency and that the lawsuits that will come from this will go to a US Supreme Court that will very soon have a strong second amendment support. It may take a while to get there and get one more justice out of there, but at the end of the day, all of this will get made unconstitutional. Additionally, the 2 million illegals who likely voted in this last election will hopefully be deported, returning this state to the people who are tax paying citizens.
Failing that, I will leave this state and move to Texas, or Alaska where this type of idiocy is seen for what it is. So many good Californians have left. They left with the aerospace jobs, they left when heavy industry evaporated. They left when the population explosion made catching a trout became like winning a lottery ticket, and they left when The state axes began to rival the federal rates. The state is in its death throws. Worst education system in America, and the most naive population in existence.
Californians are universally hated throughout the nation. This used to be a proud western state with western ideals, where Hollywood and the artistic elite did not set public policy. It is now a bordello.
I respectfully disagree with your first sentence for having two wrongs in one phrase.
So If A family member is giving me a built lower receiver for an A.R. 15, and I plan on building it into an assault rifle Will it have to be serialized and registered by 2017 or 2018?
“You can still purchase stripped lowers after January 1, 2017, however, they must NEVER have an evil feature attached to them. All lowers and rifles purchased after January 1, 2017 MUST be built as featureless rifles.”
Can you purchase a lower after Jan 1 and add the mag lock so you have to disassemble the action, and then add the “features?”
I’m not a lawyer or anything but from what I have read, I would say yes due to the fact that with the mag lock (becomes fixed magazine) it is no longer defined as an assault weapon.
So two questions if I may?
1. I’ve seen talk of increased restrictions with regard to Assault Weapons, one of those being transportation. From what I’ve been reading, it appears that I will no longer be able to keep my AR pistol in the trunk of my car, which I do for obvious reasons. This means it goes everywhere with me. Is this no longer the case now with having to register it?
2. If the new “Crack Action” locks are the new way to keep from registering my AR pistols or Rifles does that also mean I can sell any of the pistol or rifles that are carrying those devices?
Not sure if this has been brought up yet but, CA Penal code 30955 states
“The department’s registration procedures shall provide the option of joint registration for any assault weapon or .50 BMG rifle owned by family members residing in the same household.”
So that means when one person on the joint registration passes the other registered family member/s can still legally posses the assault weapon or .500 BMG rifle, correct?
That is how I took it also. But it sounds like you better have the second person there with you before you purchase from the FFL. I don’t see being able to do it afterward. Maybe even now is a good idea with 22 days left.
Is my M1A SOCOM 16 a assault weapon?
No. As long as it is in standard rifle configuration, (i.e. no flash hider, no pistol grip, no telescoping stock, and no forward pistol grip) you’re fine.
I am moving from Texas to California. The last part of the article states that anyone moving into California will not be in compliance as AW. I am assuming that is true if it is not featureless and does not have a bullet button? If if put a bullet button on my ARs and AK 47, will they be in compliance, and I can register them in 2017?
Thanks,
KP
KP, from one citizen to another, save yourself, don’t move to California! SERIOUSLY!
1. Your problem is that you cannot transfer any AR-Style weapon into California without making it California compliant and routing it through an FFL compliant Weapons Store. Especially within the next 18 days you have to do so. Your best bet is to leave them in Texas and have a family member store them (Cause you will want to go back!). 2. I don’t believe you will get into residency in time to buy a standard AR here. I admit I may be wrong on this one but given how the law is here, I doubt I am.
Sounds like Crazyfornia will soon be getting sued in SCOTUS to comply with the Constitution once Trump appoints another Conservative or two.
That, or they’re simply going to have to exist with absolutely ZERO Federal Funds for ANYTHING until they rejoin the nation they’re part of and stop the stupidity and prosecution of law abiding citizens while protecting and keeping criminals on the public teat.
I saw some liberal blogging about how California can do just fine on its own without Federal assistance. I work for the State and she has no idea what she is talking about, especially during Fire Season.
Like you I am hoping that the new administration leaves them no choice but to completely comply with the 2nd. I’m not looking forward to California becoming the next Germany/France.
“Tac” quite right as “things do burn”
gunfighter:
Q?: with an understanding of your legal advise disclaimer.. as to elements of featureless arms as discussed above, if a comp is present where historically a flash may have been present, must the comp be pined & welded?
Yes, the compensator would need to be permanently pinned and welded. Not because the barrel had a flash hider previously, but the fact that possession of any threaded barrel in the State of California is a felony; as threaded barrels can be used to attach sound suppressors / silencers.
(Please also use full firearm terms or lingo to avoid potential confusion.)
Regarding dedicated 22LR uppers on a BB lower, how would that work in a household with registered AR AWs?
Can the two coexist and is the BB even required on the 22LR rifle, or is it arguable that a 5.56 upper can be installed on the Non-BB lower “too easily” for harmonious, legal coexistence?
If you own an AR-15 lower that can accept a rim-fire .22LR upper but possess no other semiautomatic center-fired uppers that can be attached to the lower, then you should be fine without needing a Bullet Button in California.
However, if you own any additional semiautomatic center-fired upper other than the dedicated .22LR upper, they will get you under “Constructive Possession” without a Bullet Button.
How does the new legislation allow a rifle which currently has a bullet button to be modified to use a “free state” mag release simply by registering the weapon as an “assault rifle?”
I thought the purpose of the law (in this case) was to make it MORE difficult to swap mags rather than LESS difficult.
I own a pistol-caliber carbine designed with the magazine well in the pistol grip, so making it featureless is not an option. That’s why I’m all for removing the BB and replacing it with a real mag release. I need proof that I can legally do this.
Thanks,
Golden Bear
You have to think of it this way. You can’t be charged for having an assault weapon if your weapon is already registered as an assault weapon.
So in other words, if you register your bullet buttoned AR as an assault weapon, they can’t charge you with possession of an assault weapon if you change out your bullet button for a regular “Free State” mag release as there is no such thing as making an assault weapon a more or greater assault weapon. The only issue I can think of is if you have a rifle with a barrel that is less that 16″ but you haven’t paid the Feds the $200 Tax Stamp.
I’m pretty sure there are going to be a lot of people with 10″, 12″ and 14.5″ barreled uppers who are going to eventually pay that stamp after registration.
This was true at the time of the initial discussion, but as of 12/30/2016, a new set of gun laws by California DOJ patched this loophole as indicated below:
• The release mechanism for an ammunition feeding device on an assault weapon registered pursuant to Penal Code section 30900, subdivision (b)(1) shall not be changed after the assault weapon is registered.
• The Department will not register a firearm as an assault weapon unless the firearm is fully assembled and fully functional.
Is it possible to install a mag release and then register the rifle, or does the installation violate existing law? I’m not being naïve.
As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
Anyone know where I have to go to register my AR. In Los Angeles
California Reporting Information System (CRIS):
https://cfars.doj.ca.gov/login.do
folding stock after registered as AW? lol
Yep
Can I still go shooting outdoors rather than a regular gun range?
Yes.
Iv heard that a bayonet leg has to be removed in order for the rifle to be considered featureless. Is that true
No, that is not true. The bayonet lug was illegal under the Clinton federal AW ban from 1994 to 2004. Cali law does not address a bayonet lug as an evil feature.
What if I inherit an AW that is featureless and not registered 3 years from now, will i then be able to add features to it as long as I am willing to register it, or does it have to remain featureless to keep it?
If a registered AW becomes featureless the 2nd owner has to keep it that way.
If I simply move out of state with a California registered assault weapon because the gun laws become ridiculous like this. Will I legally be able to transfer it to the new state aka Nevada or will I be forced to surrender it in California? I know I can’t re enter with it but I was sure abiut exiting with it indefinitely
Cali law can’t touch your gun outside the state. If you have a registered assault weapon in California you CAN move out of the state and keep your gun. However, if you ever move back into the state the gun cannot come with you unless it is featureless or uses the AR Maglock. Also, you are supposed to DE-register the gun if the gun is permanently removed form the state.
Question, If I have already registered my AR back in the 1990s do I have to re-register it again?
If yes, can someone provide me with the BOF number of the form?
If you already have a pre-2001 registered Assault Weapon, then this new law does not apply to you as it is for AR-15s with the Bullet Button magazine-release configurations.
I really appreciate you taking the time to write this article. I’ve been extensively searching to answer a question I have considering its very conditional.
I have a AR15 that was built from a “serialized”/engraved 80% lower I did, prior to 2017, that I plan to run in this configuration until the end of 2017 at which point I will install a bullet button reloaded to keep it “featured” and unregistered. From what I understand that is okay.
My question pertains to a build I want to do, which is an AR pistol. Problem is, I am 20 years old, my birthday is 12/17/2017, so I cant complete a AR pistol until then. Would I be able to complete a engraved 80% lower pistol, with a bullet button reloaded and single shot sled, then convert it to 10 rd during 12/17/17-12/31/17, and keep it into 2018 unregistered, utilizing the BB reloaded and the fact its a serialized lower ?
To put it more simply and make it more applicable to others, can you complete a 80% lower AR pistol during 2017 and keep it unregistered?
I understand the way I’m reading it that its a no go after 2018, but cant tell if its dead after 2017 too. With a AR rifle you can just build featureless in 2017 or use the BB 2.0, for the Pistol I cant tell if building in 2017 is okay. Thanks.
NOTHING in any law passed this year, AB 857 or any other law, prevents you from completing your own gun via an 80% lower. The law says that if you do complete a lower you must serialize the gun and report it’s existence to the DOJ. You can still complete the lower. My understanding is that you cannot make an AR pistol from an 80% until you are 21 years of age, but you’re fine after that.
Does this mean I can remove my bullet button and use a standard “free state” mag release?
Yes. Your AR or AK style gun is classified as an “assault weapon” regardless if you are using a bullet button, so why not switch it to having a free-state mag release? Understand, you MUST register your gun with the DOJ as an “assault weapon” OR make it featureless before you do this. If you have a free-state mag release and your gun is not registered as an “assault weapon”or featureless, then you are guilty of a felony.
I was just told by my local gun store that this is not true. They said the received a bulletin from California DOJ on this very thing. If my AR came with a California Bullet Button, it has to stay on the weapon. To remove the bullet button even with the gun registered is to commit a felony. Can someone give me some clarification on this, not just opinion but hard fact from DOJ or somewhere else?
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
” When Tyranny becomes law, Rebilion becomes duty!”
Amen brother.
Thanks for explaining. Please keep us updated.
what do i do with my ak? is it just grips and flash suppressor that i need to switch out?
You can make it featureless or use a product that requires disassembly of the receiver. There is a product called the AK Maglatch that will do this.
can i have the maglock features to my ak instead of going featureless? ive looked all over social media and no one seems to have an answer. please help. thanks #2ndAmendment
The AR Maglock and Patriot Mag Release will not work on an AK, but there is a product for the AK called the AK MagLatch.
A friend has a Springfield Armory SAR 8 purchased in 1995 in CA, with a thumb hole stock. Was he required to re-register it prior to 2000? If so, if he makes it featureless now, is he still in violation of the original 1989 CA Assault Weapons ban?
Also, was a firearm listed on the Roberti/Roos ban, which was registered as required, affected by the latest bills and Prop 63? Nothing I have read so far, addresses any of the original re-registered firearms then. Only those from 2001 until 2016.
These new laws specifically preclude anyone who owned a gun before the original ban and failed to register from registering it now. Your friend is basically a felon and will continue to be one under the new laws.
my buddy wants to buy a ghost gun. I warned him about that.
so what kind of trouble has he got himself into?
Any “ghost gun” cannot be legally sold after being completed. To have one, a person must finish the 80% lower by their own accord. Sorry, but going to one of those “build parties” where you just push a button on someone else’s CNC machine is illegal, as the owner if the machine is considered an illegal manufacturer of firearms. If you do use another’s CNC machine, you better be able to explain and possibly demonstrate the set up and tolerances needed to complete the project. To be safe, buy a simple jig and then drill and use a router to mill and finish it. Take photos of yourself doing it too in case you need proof that you did the work.
So, if I register my AR’s Can I have all the “evil” feartures? And does the law say that I cannot sell, give or loan the firearm to someone outside of California? I don’t think it does. So I will register them and if and when they come dor them, which I doubt, I’ll send them to my buddy in Georgia to hold until I move the hell out of here…
Yes. Registration means you can have the evil features. Yes, the gun can always be sent out of state. Cali law can’t touch the gun if it is not in the state.
The NRA having a limited budget had to pass on an all-out effort in CA, much to my dismay, but will be challenging all these asinine weapon disarmament laws to the highest court that will hear them. The statistics were against CA citizens by the idiotic liberals who have flooded our state with illegals and the establishment of lawless “sanctuary” cities. If the state has decided to allow selective enforcement of our Federal laws I suppose the People can establish “sanctuary” cities that do not have CA law compliance. Works both ways.
Two questions I have not seen definitively answered here or anywhere else:
1. Can I replace the current “bullet button” mag release on my full-featured AR-15 with a regular, free-state mag release button at *any* point (i.e., before or after registering as an “assault weapon”), or can I do this only if I decide to go featureless (or at all)?
2. Has the “AR Mag-Lock” ever been officially recognized by DOJ as having satisfied the legal requirements for rendering the magazine as “fixed” (thus not requiring one to either register or go featureless)?
In all my searching, I have not been able to find where DOJ has weighed in on either of these matters. All I’ve seen so far are based on people’s interpretation of the new law as it is written. And while the answers given certainly stand to reason, I’ve yet to see anything out there by way of “official” announcement by the Powers That Be.
Any line on this would be greatly appreciated.
The AR Maglock has not been “officially recognized” by the DOJ and it never will be. Darin Prince, the inventor of the original bullet button (and the Patriot Mag Release) has applied on numerous occasions for a determination letter for the original bullet button, but the DOJ has never given him one. They just won’t do that.
As far as swapping out the mag release to a free state release on a featured rifle, as of 1/12/17 you can do so after you register the gun. However, the DOJ is proposing that you must keep the bullet button on the gun and is under challenge in this regard. It’s best to just wait and see how it plays out. I’ll update this article when a final decision is made.
Thanks for your response, however, and short of any sort of “official” word, I’m still not sure how anyone is making the determination as to whether products such as the AR Maglock or the Patriot Mag Release do actually satisfy the “fixed magazine” requirement other than their own interpretation of the law. I’ve seen your response to another question which would indicate in the affirmative (e.g., that one can legally re-enter the state of California with a full-featured AR-15 if one first installs an AR Maglock), yet the question remains: How can anyone know this with certainty if the DOJ steadfastly refuses to weigh in on the issue?
As far as I know, no licensed firearms dealer in California will facilitate transfer of full-featured AR with such devices installed as of January 1. Isn’t that the real test, or do others know something that they don’t?
This is more of a question than a comment.
In addressing the new gun laws you posted the following (taken from your July 5th blog) – “You can do either of two things to your gun to avoid the classification of “assault weapon.” You do not need to do both, just one. First, you can install a device that requires you to disassemble the action in order to remove the mag/reload. I will have more on this in the next few days and will post another article as soon as I have this information. Stay tuned. Second, you can remove all evil features from your gun. If you remove all of the evil features from your gun, then you can have a standard mag release. No more bullet buttons if you go this route.”
I personally want to follow the new laws and at the same time would rather not register my gun but would like my AR to look and handle like an AR. When I read the law myself, I keep getting hung up on the word “and” when referring to the type of weapon (center fire and fixed magazine) AND evil features. I would love to hear your further input on this. Do you still believe that all you have to do is install a devise like the “bullet button unloaded or other type of magazine lock” and then semi-disassembly for a magazine release would avoid the “and” wording of the law in regards to the “evil features” of an AR?
I have watched numerous videos about the magazine lock and although its a small extra step, it seems like the best alternative to keep the AR looking and handling like an AR without having to register it.
Your further input around the wording of the law would be greatly appreciated.
Take a look at that section. It has been updated as of 1/12/17. You have no obligation to register as long as you install a device like the AR maglock.
If I remove all of my evil features and make my ar15 featureless. Will I be able to bring it with me if I move into California after January 1, 2017
Yes. If the rifle is featureless then it is fine to import into the state.
As long as it is on an “off list lower”.
Who’s going to be the first company to come out with a heavy-duty extend barrel nut for AR pistol’s
Refusing to register (i.e. to break the law) is not a good long-term plan. Better to modify your rifle so it no longer fits the definition of an “assault rifle.” Donate money or volunteer your time in support of credible second amendment organizations and sue the local/state government every chance you get. Get politically involved and work against politicians who trample on the Constitution. Speak out every chance you get. Never stop fighting because the gun grabbers won’t.
I apologize profusely if this has been covered, but I literally read the comments for over two hours before writing this…
Is it expressly decreed in any of these new laws that I CANNOT sell my legally acquired “assault weapon” (by the current legal definition) to an out-of-state buyer with transfer to an FFL through an auction site like Gun Broker!?
To be quite honest I’m done trying to legally own rifle in this state. I don’t want to register anything, or convert anything, and I certainly don’t want to surrender my property. Can I legally sell my detachable mag, center-fire, “evil” rifles to someone who lives in a free state, between 01-01-2017 and 12-31-2017?
Thank You
Yes. You can sell the rifle out of state. As long as the rifle leaves the state Cali law can’t touch it.
Ryan, after Jan 1, 2017 can I take my unregistered “AW” to the range or transport it in any way? Assuming it is not featureless.
Once you register your gun the rules change on how you can transport it. You can still take it to the range.
So according to the DOJ, a threaded barrel in a pistol makes it an assault weapon. Does this mean I get to buy threaded barrels and register my glock now? Asking for a friend
No. Threaded pistol barrels are still illegal for you to use. The state, at least in every proposal I’ve seen, will not let you register a Glock.
I would point out the fact that Commiefornia insisted on the registration of SKS short (16″) barreled rifles with detachable magazines, and the State later insisted those rifles be turned in for “compensation”… those foolish enough to register them LOST their RIGHT to keep those firearms! Registration leads to one rotten conclusion, confiscation.. period. With the current condition of our “legislature”‘being throttled by the Socialist Demoncrat party, I feel that it is only going to get worse, and waiting for relief from the courts will take years, while the damage is done. Passive resistance has worked in other states where restrictive and ridiculous laws have been passed and firearms owners simply DID NOT COMPLY! Follow your conscience, but I beg you, try to send the cost of a box of ammo to any of the firearms/2nd Amendment foundations, like Calguns, to fight this thing any way they can!
So with the new Ca. Law pertaining to so called assault rifles, if I were to cut off my thumb, would I be required to still remove the pistol grip from my ar’s? Would I be required to cut off even my left thumb even though I am right handed? Just curious!
Yes, you would still need to remove the pistol grip as we’re a nation of rules. So what is the point you’re trying to prove here?
would i be able to still pick up my stripped lower receiver after jan 1, 2017 with DROS done and 10 wait period done. my ffl said they won’t let me have it.. I’m so confused with all this.
The very last days you could purchase an AR-15 including the stripped lower is 12/21/2016. This allowed you to pick it up from the store on 12/31/2016.
However, if you purchased one on 12/21/2016 and tries to pick up on 01/01/2017, you would be denied the ownership. The store should have informed you on this, or else refused sales after 12/21/2016 as common courtesy.
The info regarding taking your Bullet Button off once you have a RAW has now changed (thanks DOJ!).
You must keep the Bullet Button on the rifle, once it’s registered.
https://www.firearmspolicy.org/alerts/breaking-calif-doj-files-bullet-button-assault-weapons-regulations-with-oal/
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
Until these new reg’s are challenged in court I suggest, as a matter of protest, that we all register not our our firearms but our vehicles instead as “assault weapons”. They’re way more dangerous and cause way more carnage than firearms do.
where do i register my AR15 ? i didnt find the website , i also have a vepr12 shotgun, do i need to register this as assault weapon as well ? it has a stock and “removable” magazIne
As of this writing on 1/12/17 the state has not released the website yet. Stay tuned.
Is there any kind of legislature proposed to repeal this law?
No. It’s a socialist state. We are going to have to start at the grass roots level and do the hard work to win. it took 20 years to get this bad and it will likely take 20 years to fix it.
Question: if someone took possession of a stripped lower in December 2016 can they still build it with the “evil features” and a maglock system and not register it?
Asking for a friend.
Thank you
Yes. That is fine. A stripped lower can be built with an AR Maglock and also with as many evil features as they’d like. This article has been updated as of 1/12/17 to reflect this.
IMPORTANT UPDATES:
As of 12/30/2016, a new set of gun laws by California DOJ patched the loophole to convert the Bullet Button to a “free-state” standard magazine release. Also, the ability to register an AR-15 as an Assault Weapon without an upper attached is also not accepted (a stripped lower by itself cannot be registered):
• The release mechanism for an ammunition feeding device on an assault weapon registered pursuant to Penal Code section 30900, subdivision (b)(1) shall not be changed after the assault weapon is registered.
• The Department will not register a firearm as an assault weapon unless the firearm is fully assembled and fully functional.
Online Registration System – California Reporting Information System (CRIS):
https://cfars.doj.ca.gov/login.do
Let me see if I have this straight. They are now saying that a weapon with a bullet button is illegal due to 1 January 2017 it being an assault weapon, but once you register it as an assault weapon you have to leave the bullet button on?
How is there not a law against stupid politicians creating stupid laws in California?
As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
That is just a proposal. DOJ was asking the Office of Administrative Law (the state agency that actually publishes law) to publish and thereby make that law, but that is being challenged. In short, it is NOT law yet and is currently under challenge and may not become law. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
What about Saiga shotguns? Are they not included in this bullshit because the new laws refer to “rifles”?
Well, I’m not sure any more. It was my understanding that ALL mag fed shotguns are now considered to be assault weapons, but Chuck Michel of Michel & Associates is challenging that aspect of the law (in a pre-litigation letter, no law suit yet) saying that the new regs don’t affect shotguns at all. He is claiming that the new law only affects rifles and pistols and has no affect on shotguns. As of right now (1/12/17) we should just wait until the final regs are released. The requirement to keep the bullet button on the gun even after it is registered is under challenge and may not make it into the final law. Let’s see the final law once it is released by the DOJ and published by the OAL.
Has any new information come out in regards to the Semi Shotguns? or how to make them Featurless?
I would like to purchase a CZ Scorpion Carbine, which is illegal. I was wondering if I had someone out of state build a California compliant version and sold it to me through FFL dealer, would that be legal?
It would have to be featureless, but yes, as long as it were Cali-legal under the new law it would be fine and we would transfer it.
So if I buy a stripped lower receiver after Jan 1st 2017 I can’t take it out until it’s fully built into a featureless model? I plan on building a A4 build so all I need is the grip wrap and muzzle break and I’m good to go.
Hey folks, just FYI, these are statutes and not actually “law” in the strictest sense. Statutes are only enforceable by consent. They trick us in to consenting in various ways, which technically means they are void since all terms of contract were not disclosed.
This has to do with common law and our natural rights, which the Constitution RECOGNIZES. The Constitution does not “give” rights. Your rights exists because you exist, i.e. you’re born with them.
These truths require some deeper, independent research but I encourage everyone to educate themselves because neither the media nor the education system will do so. Law enforcement ESPECIALLY needs to know this!! LEOs please don’t enforce these statutes – defend the constitution and restore the republic!
What are the requirements for serializing an 80% lower [completed]? Do I have to before a specific date? Or do it at all? My plan of course is to either build it featureless or have an ARMag Lock attached.
If I built my rifle in 2016 with a lower receiver engraved as “multi” caliber, can I swap calibers after registering my rifle as an assault weapon? I’m not trying to go SBR, but my rifle has interchangeable barrels and bolts for at least 3 calibers and I don’t want to be restricted to only one after registering with the DOJ.
Ryan,
Does this mean I can install a standard mag release and still keep my “evil features” on my AR until I have to make it feature-less or register it before Jan 1, 2018???
If my AR is not registered as a “assault weapon” can I still let my brother borrow to go shoot? I only read, once it is registered as a assault weapon Noone else can shoot that rifle but the registered ownee
If I build a featureless AR 15 from an 80% lower will I still need to register my AR in California?
I’m going to register my AR with bullet button as an “Assault Weapon”, take the bullet button off and make it a regular ass AR, get a box and send them my $20 in pennies loose in the box. Make those fu%#ers count it… We should all do it.
Notice that all the alleged laws are no laws at all, but merely a code. A code we the people are not bound to. Read the code (not law) for yourself, does it read, the people, as in man or woman are required, obligated, bound, commanded or ordered to do anything such as register their property (AR15).
People, we are free remember? As in all people are free, read your California Constitution right at the top, you can’t miss it.
The code, which is not a law, read something like this, “This Act shall be known as the CALIFORNIA PENAL CODE”. Does that sound like a law? Of course not.
If you read the penal code , it will repeat over and over no person shall, all persons shall. Did God create man or person. If you are Godless, then you are a person and bound to code. If you believe in God, you are one of His people as in We the people give thanks to God Almighty for our freedom.
We have to stop believing this lie. We are not bound and never ordered to do anything. Read any code you wish. Prove it to yourself.
Pardon me if this has been answered.. But theoretically, while not necessarily practical, one could operate an “AR pistol” without an “evil hand-guard” or ‘barrel shroud”, right?
What would be the limitations of making your AR, or AK pistol for that matter “featureless” without said “evil feature”?
It’s scary to hear Californians talk about gun rights, as though they have them. All the discussion is about how to skirt laws so that they can maintain a semi-functional “CA Compliant” tool that really needs to be fully-functional. In free states, it’s hard to comprehend what you guys think is freedom and why you still live in a communist state that is ever seeking to restrict your rights further.
It’s even scarier to hear people talk like it’s ok to up and run from what is essentially the front lines of the battle. Or nonsense like ‘no sales to california’. Grow some balls and stand up for America, Billy. Fukkin’ cowards.
http://michellawyers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Letter-to-DOJ-re-Bullet-Button-Assault-Weapons_1.9.17.pdf
Is this in regards to the question of whether a ‘registered AW’ can keep or ditch the bullet button, once registered?
I personally purchased two lowers that I otherwise probably would not have because of these new laws. I have been holding out on building them out because I am waiting for questions on what kind of bells and whistles I can put on it to be answered, plus I want to wait for the rush of people building out their ARs at the beginning of the year to pass.
I mean if we have to register them as Assault Weapons we may as well go all in. Will not using a bullet button make them less of an assault weapon? What about other existing assault weapons without bullet buttons? I doubt that they can do anything to change this without repealing and re-voting on the revised law. Also I find it hilarious that even if you wanted to, you cannot even register them as assault weapons yet because the Cal DOJ website hasn’t implemented any actual system to do so.
The VG6 Gamma now has packaging that lists flash suppression as a feature. I have one, but I’m not going to chance it on a featureless build. I have no idea why VG6 changed the packaging since I highly doubt the Gamma has any measurable impact on flash, but I’d hate to be on the wrong end of the law when a prosecutor pulls out the Gamma’s package and reads that to a jury. Man this sucks.
2 questions: When you use the term “free state” mag realeases. Are you just referring to the stock mag release an assault rifle is manufactured with? Or is there some new mag release out there Ive never heard of?
And my second question is , because it wasn’t clear, if I want to sell my rifle (registered or not…but NOT featureless ) sometime in the future OUT OF STATE…are you saying I can’t? And to be more clear…It is always “attached to me”…even if I want to sell it out of state? I understand we can not sell, give, hand down or inherit it with in CA. But who the hell is CA to say what another person in another state who’s laws allow such weapons can do or not? Thanks.
I plan on turning my 100% lowers into featureless, and will not be registering them but would like to know if I need to serialize my lowers and if so do I have to use the same standards as an AW with
serial #
caliber
my name
city state
and do I have to use my full name or can I use just my last name
Everyone please resit registering your guns. Make them featureless or put on the ARMaglock, the Patriot mag release OR the Cross Armory quick pins and safe mag.
Then let The Communist Republic of California’s realize they did not make money off of our toys.
I purchased my AR 15 style assault weapon in North Carolina when I was on active duty orders (army) in 2012. I brought the gun back to my home state of California in 2013. I have never registered it and am now just realizing I should have registered it.
I never use my gun and now want to sell it. If I keep the gun the way it is (evil), can I sell it out of state before Jan 2018?
I just bought a Ruger AR-556 featureless on 05/08/17. If I install
a ARMAGLOCK kit can I replace the featureless with evil features
and not register it?
Can I bring my AR-15 with me when I move to California if I uninstall the “evil features’, make it into a featureless AR by installing the necessary items, install an AR MAGLOCK to my weapon, and register it with the California DOJ? Thanks to those who reply.
Hi Does any one have information on requirements for AK47 VEPR 12 and Century Arms Catamount Fury ii to make them featureless or put some kind of Maglock so we don’t have to register it?
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